Need advice on how best to remove mosaic tile trim and pencils without damaging drywa

[729Zoom]

Hello. I hired a licensed tile contractor to retile my bathroom and, though the job installing the field tile is acceptable, the installation of the mosaic trim and jolly pencils is not what we agreed on and is subpar at best. He installed a chipped tile, another with exposed unfinished edges, mosaic is crooked, pieces sticking out or too far in, and the mitering of the inside corners of the pencils looks like I did it. He didn’t even attempt to miter the mosaic for the outside corners, as agreed, but used an ugly 1/4 round that looks very much out of place and interrupts the design of the mosaic. This trim is all black so with white grout, the problems will be even more noticeable. I have spent too much time, money and energy to leave what is the featured tile like this. So, I told him not to grout anything and find another tile setter who knows how to miter mosaic tile and the Daltile jolly pencils properly. I will also need that same person to finish installing the crown molding (using a ceramic 2” wide chair for the top of the ceiling), the last layer of wall tile over the countertop and cabinet, and to grout everything when complete. I live in Los Angeles and if there are any recommendations for a tile setter here who, for sure, can miter mosaic and pencils properly, I will be forever grateful.

In the meantime, THE MAIN QUESTION I HOPE TO GET ADVICE ON, is how best to remove these UN-GROUTED tiles to avoid damage to drywall behind and above the tile. I paid a lot for level 5 drywall finishing that was scheduled after he finished the tile. I pray there is a technique to protect the drywall just above the tile and behind the tile. (He tiled directly to the drywall in the non wet areas - only floated the shower tub section).

I am attaching a couple of pictures below of some of the problem areas and also a picture of the job overall. In the comments, I will include a pictures showing a couple of the inside corners mitered.

Thank you!

[729Zoom]

[cx]

Welcome, Zoom.

If you don't add that geographic location to your User Profile, the information will be lost before we leave this page and the information is frequently helpful in responding to some types of questions.

Clearly some lack of attention to detail there. And the use of sharply contrasting grout colors stark colored tiles always exacerbates all the defects.

Unfortunately, repairing such defects is usually a good bit more difficult than taking care not to have them. And if the problems are in a wet area, depending upon the type of waterproofing that was used, repairs can be even more difficult and damaging.

I don't see a question for us here. If your intent is to find another local professional to take over the job (a very difficult thing to convince a good professional to do), let's have you start another thread in the Professionals' Hangout with your request and location in the title and a link to this thread in the body for any discussion. Sometimes that works, more times not, unfortunately.

If you have trouble with the link, just start the thread and I'll put the link in there on your behalf.

My opinion; worth price charged.

[729Zoom]

Hello, thank you for responding. And if you can help me with a link to the pro section, I would really appreciate it. I live in Los Angeles. The areas with the mistakes are mainly in dry areas and the ones in the wet sections, I could maybe live with those and just redo the sections in the dry areas. And that is what I wanted to find out, if possible to remove the pencils and mosaic in the dry sections in a way that won't damage the drywall, at least above it. I just paid a drywall company to hang and finish the drywall and the thought of paying them again makes my stomach hurt. But maybe this should be the cost of the tile contractor if he redoes it and damages? What is considered fair in a situation like this?

[Davy]

Here's the pro hangout. https://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin...isplay.php?f=4

There's usually not an easy way to get the tile off unless he didn't bond them well. All you can do is get a hammer and small chisel and start knocking them off. I wouldn't get carried away, take it slow and easy with it.

[729Zoom]

Thank you, Davey. I hope I can find a new tile setter who has experience with detail work like this. I think the guy I hired is someone who might do a lot of cheap commercial jobs where they just put in basic tile on walls.

[Davy]

Like Cx said, finding someone that's good and willing to take over a job is tough.

[729Zoom]

Want to ask Davy and others if, from seeing the pictures of the chipped tile, etc. if you think it is unreasonable to not want to leave it like this.

[Davy]

I don't think you're being unreasonable to want it fixed. Some guys just don't have an eye or patience for that sort of thing.

[729Zoom]

Davey, if I can't find a new tile guy, do you think I should give this guy a chance to fix it and ask him to cover the cost of the new mosaic and any fixes from the drywall contractor if there is damage done removing? I want to get this done so I can move on but I don't have confidence that this guy can do it if he put it up like that to begin with. It looks like he doesn't even know how to d a miter cut of a pencil. He had agreed to miter those outside corners but ended up using that black quarter round which also looks bad.

[Davy]

You'll have to make that call. Show him your concerns and that he didn't install the tiles like you discussed.

[729Zoom]

I am getting bids on correcting a very bad tile installation and one of the tile contractors just told me that the wire mesh that was used to float the two walls (including the shower area) is wrong and that it will crack/fail. The squares of the mesh are 2" x 2" - and told it should have been diamond shaped metal lath.
I was hoping to not tear out everything - just the part of the wall that would allow us to redo the border tile - but if what this guy is saying is true, maybe I have to remove the entire thing and start over but wanted to ask others to weigh in and let me know what is standard? Maybe the guy who just left is wrong and just trying to convince me to tear it all out?

FYI: the picture below shows where the float ended and was left to allow for the vanity and countertop to be put in and then the last row of tiles would be added over the countertop.

[cx]

Zoom, it'll help if you'll keep all your project questions on one thread so folks can see what you're working on and what's been previously asked and answered. A moderator can give it a more generic title any time you'd like to suggest one.

I think that contractor has a valid point. While that welded wire mesh is listed in the ANSI standards as a Reinforcing Wire Fabric (if it is at least 16 gauge), it is more commonly used in the vertical center of reinforced floor mortar beds. The expanded metal lath usually specified for use behind wall mortar (ASTM C847) is a very different animal. And there is an alternative material called Woven Wire Plaster Base (ASTM C1032), commonly referred to incorrectly as chicken wire, which we see used almost exclusively in California.

I'm not at all sure how that fella could "hang" his mortar on that welded wire, presuming the wire was fastened to open joists as in your photo above, but maybe your current contractor knows some magic. We have a couple California mud men here on the forums and maybe one of them is familiar with that method. I've never seen it.

My opinion; worth price charged

[729Zoom]

Hi CX - I woke up trying to find the tread from yesterday so posted by question again before I saw this. Sorry about that and I will try to delete the other one again.

Regarding the wire mesh that was used for the floated wall. I want to make sure I am understanding correctly. Are you saying that this new contractor is correct that the first guy used the wrong mesh for the float? If so, is it because the space is to big and will crack? Is there a specific reference I could look up for this?

[729Zoom]

One more thing - the picture showing the wire the first guy used, is definitely wrong for walls? Any mud guys able to weigh in on this and tell me what this is from the picture?