Waterproofing and tiling in earthquake country

[markch]

So I did purchase the JB books. I'll keep looking through the posts here for information, but I tend to find the organization of the book a bit better.
I'm about to start a shower build with the general parameters:
- 5'x32"
- hardibacker walls
- hydroban waterproofing
- mud pan
- frameless doors.

Some questions I'm hoping to answer in a book (and lurking here):
- It would be good to go curbless because of the narrow shower size. If not, what's the thinnest curb possible?
- Do you do additional waterproofing on the floor if using curbless?
- What are the design constraints for curbless?
- What do you attach a frameless door to (do screws go through tile and into studs on both the wall and the floor? Just the floor? Can you break tiles free if you bump into the door?
- Technology seems to be moving fast. The hydroban seems way more time efficient than, say Kerdi. Am I missing something?

[John Bridge]

Hi Mark,

Liquid waterproofers are faster, and since there are no overlaps, there's little if any build-up in the corners. Sheet membranes allow the satisfaction of knowing you have proper thickness throughout.

There are never screws driven into any horizontal shower part, including the floor.

Use the search. You'll find a ton of info in Hydro Ban showers.

[markch]

Thank you! By the way, the book is awesome - there are just clearly too many details to fit into one (or a two-part) book!

I'd like to go the way of hydro ban, but it will be pretty cheap to practice on some mock ups -- fashion a box out of out of duroc, apply, and food test. What should I look for for amateur mistakes?

In fact, I feel like I should practice every step on an easier substrate than the actual shower where failure means a lost morning and not catastrophe. I'll start a new thread asking for advice on setting up practice boards.

[markch]

So as a weekend warrior gearing up to do a shower, I'm realizing that just jumping in from the get go is a bad idea. Instead, I want to build a mini mock shower with some duroc, then go from mud pan to water proofing to tiling. The goal is to build it, then check for things that would have failed if I did this in the actual shower.

Any suggestions for:
-- size of mockup?
-- tests for water proofing?
-- tests to make sure tiles are correctly bonded?

Thanks in advance!

[cbaum]

That's funny because when I was planning on pouring my shower pan I had considered doing the same thing since I have no previous experience. I was going to do the full size and try to replicate the same conditions to make sure I got it right.

If I were you, I'd just practice pouring the pan and do a waterproof test as that is the real key.

Now, I'm going with a schluter pan but I have decided to do large format tile on the pan and I'm buying a cheap pre formed pan and some cheap HD 12x24 tile and I'm going to practice tiling that using the method I saw on youtube. I figure $60-$70 to practice will be totally worth it to not only make sure I can achieve it, but also give me one practice run.

[Kman]

Mark, everything you've planning to practice on has been done many times over, and if you follow the manufacturer's instructions and the advice given here, you'll have a waterproof shower.

Just promise that if you run into something you're not sure about, you'll stop and come back here for advice. We have a number of people that come here after they've already gotten through a major step, and had problems because they weren't sure about what they were doing. Then they just have to backtrack and cost themselves more time and money. It's frustrating for them, and for us.

The only part I can agree that a person might want to practice on would be the mud floor. Mud is cheap, and pretty easy to work with. Most people just need a little practice on getting the ratios correct, and getting the proper slope. You can do that in a 3'x3' mock-up several times over and not spend $50.

[Tiger Mountain Tile Inc]

I make my curbs skinny and I do it out of a 2-inch piece of foam board. In this case, it was Wedi board but I believe you can get 2-inch in Hydroban board also.

One thing to check, though, is how thick your shower glass enclosure will be. I've had some slider doors that were 4-inches wide and have had to make my curbs wider to accommodate.

Also, if you are doing a curbless shower you'll need to waterproof outside the shower 12-inches, I think, is the code.

Curbless also requires recessing the floor or you can use a foam system like the Wedi Ligno system if you are over a wood subfloor with a crawlspace underneath.

[markch]

Hi all,
I'm about to start placing orders for a shower redo over the holidays. I'm decent with woodworking, so will opt to furr the walls over a float. Any advice for what level of imperfections can be tolerated by hydroban board versus a durock while staying in plane -- e.g. if there is a slight void, will one board span that and the other warp into it?

Thanks,
-Mark

[Tool Guy - Kg]

With a proper fastening schedule, all the boards will hug the studs tightly and follow their contour. Only very small hollow gouges within the stud would be spanned...and that’s assuming a fastener wasn’t located exactly at the gouge.

How large are your tiles?

[Tiger Mountain Tile Inc]

For tiles under 15 inches, the standard is 1/4inch in 10ft and not more than 1/16th in 12-inches.

For tiles 15 and over, the standard is 1/8 inch in 10ft and not more than 1/16th in 24 inches.

Obviously, things should be plumb and square too.

[markch]

I see, so board type doesn't matter. Probably going for 8" hexagonal tiles. Those are some pretty tight tolerances.

[Tiger Mountain Tile Inc]

Durock will have more rigidity so it will fight the dipping in and out more so than a foam board would. But both boards will conform to the framing and you don't want to rely on the board to do the straightening out.

You mentioned that you are a proficient carpenter so get everything close and you can do the last bit of fine-tuning with some drywall shims and a planer.

[markch]

My bathroom currently has an ADA walk in shower/upright tub wired up with whirlpool jets. I feel like I should take advantage of the wiring when I take this out- is there anything out there other than a standard bathtub with jets that is popular?
Thanks,
-mark

[Kman]

Yes, this.




Are you wanting something ADA compliant?

[markch]

That's exactly what I'm thinking. Certainly not what I'm doing. My back is in constant pain, and I haven't even started the remodel yet. So a steam room would be great, but seems like more than one should try on their first foray into remodeling.