Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile

Welcome to John Bridge / Tile Your World, the friendliest DIY Forum on the Internet


Advertiser Directory
JohnBridge.com Home
Buy John Bridge's Books

Go Back   Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile > Tile & Stone Forums > Tile Forum/Advice Board

Sponsors


Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Unread 12-09-2019, 06:21 PM   #46
cx
Moderator emeritus
 
cx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Boerne, Texas
Posts: 89,558
I know nothing at all about using a compression-type fitting with any PEX-Al-PEX tubing with which I'm familiar. The Viega tubing I currently use also requires a special prep tool that removes the outer PEX layer and the aluminum layer prior to crimping on the fittings. Maybe there are compression fittings available for it? I dunno. My plumber has never mentioned any such and I've not searched for them.

Not saying you shouldn't install your conduit for your PEX water line, Wolfgang, just saying I wouldn't bother. Can't see what you've got at either end, but I'm envisioning trying to pull a new tube through that conduit after a failure of the original and I'm not much liking the picture. But maybe I just don't understand your situation.

Not sure just how a run of PEX-Al-PEX would fail in an underground run like that, but if it makes you feel better having it in conduit, by all means put it in conduit.

As for keeping water out of the conduit, I don't think I'd care at all if my conduit got completely full of water in that application.

My opinion; worth price charged.
__________________
CX

Y'ALL NEW VISITORS READ THIS HERE!
cx is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-09-2019, 06:45 PM   #47
jadnashua
Veteran DIYer- Schluterville Graduate

STAR Senior Contributor

 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Nashua, NH
Posts: 13,331
At least for some forms of pex tubing (I have a bunch of O2 barrier stuff in my radiant heating system), there are compression fittings available for it. It relies on an internal stiffener so there's something strong enough to crimp down onto. Depending on the type, that does add a slight, short, restriction, but it usually doesn't cause any significant pressure loss via friction...it's too short. The Bernoulli effect negates it on short runs, at least for the most part.
__________________
Jim DeBruycker
Not a pro, multiple Schluter Workshops (Schluterville and 2013 and 2014 at Schluter Headquarters), Mapei Training 2014, Laticrete Workshop 2014, Custom Building Products Workshop 2015, and Longtime Forum Participant.
jadnashua is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-09-2019, 07:32 PM   #48
cx
Moderator emeritus
 
cx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Boerne, Texas
Posts: 89,558
All the crimp fittings for the PEX systems I've used go inside the tubing and create a restriction, Jim.
__________________
CX

Y'ALL NEW VISITORS READ THIS HERE!
cx is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-09-2019, 11:02 PM   #49
Tool Guy - Kg
Moderator -- Wisconsin Kitchen & Bath Remodeler
 
Tool Guy - Kg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Oak Creek, WI
Posts: 21,669
Quote:
Originally Posted by makethatkerdistick
Should I drill a few small holes in the bottom of that conduit so that water that gets in can seep out?
If you want to keep the conduit dry, I’d avoid the holes at the bottom, as described. Water will seek its own level when the ground is saturated to the elevation of the pipe and you’d have an open invitation for ground water to enter.


__________________
Tonto Goldstein... but my friends call me Bubba

Help an awesome summer camp!
Tool Guy - Kg is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-19-2019, 01:19 PM   #50
makethatkerdistick
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: North Texas
Posts: 881
Finally, I installed 300 ft of my copper trunk and branch system. That concludes the hot work in the attic (except three quick hook-ups I have to perform on branches I've already pulled). I am so glad this phase is over. Soldering pipe is basically simple. What's hard is doing this in crammed poorly-lit areas filled with insulation and unexpected obstacles. Having to tie in two water heaters forced me to have two independent hot water branches. All trunks and branches are properly fastened as well.

Tomorrow, I'll be hooking up the lines to my hot water heater and pressure-testing / flushing them. I'll take some pictures when I check for leaks. I bought some Sharkbite valves that I'll put on the 1/2 in termination points in my walls inside the house that I haven't taken to their final destination yet. That way, I can flush them one by one and get all the dust and shavings out. Throughout the process, I used H2O-soluble tinning flux very sparingly (as opposed to slathering it on) as I was concerned about its corrosive properties inside the pipe. A thin coating is all that was needed.

These are the three most important tools for the job (in my humble DIY estimation):
1. A self-lighting Map gas torch with the hose attachment to keep the tank separate and have maximum freedom. Propane is usually sufficient but this gets the joint ready more quickly while you're crouched in a corner and feeling miserable.
2. An oscillating tool for cutting drywall
3. A protective heat-absorbing blanket (if you like your house and want to keep it)

As I'll be busy in the next couple of weeks I can't continue this project until February. There's still quite a bit of work left to do but it'll be inside the house where I can stand upright and enjoy my life. I sure felt like being a prisoner the last two weeks.

I'm so glad this is done. My wrists and hands hurt from all the deburring. Time for a good cup of coffee to reinvigorate myself
__________________
Wolfgang

Last edited by makethatkerdistick; 12-19-2019 at 01:44 PM.
makethatkerdistick is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-19-2019, 06:51 PM   #51
Davy
Moderator -- Mud Man
 
Davy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Princeton,Tx.- Dallas area
Posts: 32,229
Sounds like you're coming right along, way to go.
__________________
Davy

www.davystephenstile.com
Davy is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-19-2019, 09:06 PM   #52
Tool Guy - Kg
Moderator -- Wisconsin Kitchen & Bath Remodeler
 
Tool Guy - Kg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Oak Creek, WI
Posts: 21,669
I still think he should allow tours.


On a serious note: it’s a great feeling of accomplishment when you’ve finished the toughest parts of a project and your body and mind are pleased to be over the hump.
__________________
Tonto Goldstein... but my friends call me Bubba

Help an awesome summer camp!
Tool Guy - Kg is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-20-2019, 06:50 AM   #53
ss3964spd
Moderator
 
ss3964spd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Fairfax, Va
Posts: 2,788
Send a message via Yahoo to ss3964spd
Quote:
Originally Posted by TGB
...it’s a great feeling of accomplishment when you’ve finished the toughest parts of a project and your body and mind are pleased to be over the hump.
So true. Had many of those "well I'm glad THAT's finished moments".
__________________
Dan
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If I recall correctly my memory is excellent, but my ability to access it is intermittent.
ss3964spd is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-20-2019, 08:51 AM   #54
advertguy2
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Ontario
Posts: 502
Regarding the pex-al-pex mentioned a few posts above, here in Canada, there was a product maybe 15-20 years ago called Kitec by Ipex that was used by the pro's and connected with crimp rings at the fittings. Also available at Home Depot was a product called Aqua by Ipex. The pipe/tube was the same as the pro version, except it was light blue in colour instead of red and blue for the kitec. The home owner version, Aqua, used compression fittings instead of the crimp style ones. This product was discontinued 7 or 8 years ago ? because of some lawsuits or something in the US. Anyways, perhaps those are the compression fittings mentioned?
__________________
Dan
advertguy2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-20-2019, 09:06 AM   #55
cx
Moderator emeritus
 
cx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Boerne, Texas
Posts: 89,558
The Kitec lawsuits were about a corrosion problem with the fittings, Dan. Allegedly from the bi-metal reaction between the aluminum in the pipe body and the brass in the fittings. I've never encountered the problem, nor has my plumber who used a great gaggle of the stuff before it was recalled.

I don't recall the blue tubing at Homers. Usta be some white PEX available there at the time we were using the Kitec. The un-sheathed Kitec was available in blue and red single-wall as well as the PEX-Al-PEX version. I was sorry to see it go away and still like it better than the Viega we now use.

I never tried any compression fittings with either brand.
__________________
CX

Y'ALL NEW VISITORS READ THIS HERE!
cx is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-20-2019, 08:12 PM   #56
makethatkerdistick
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: North Texas
Posts: 881
I pressure-tested and flushed with hot water. I checked every single joint with my hands and am happy to report that there are no leaks. I didn't expect any, but one never knows until one tests it.

Now, it's time for a break!
__________________
Wolfgang
makethatkerdistick is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12-22-2019, 12:06 PM   #57
makethatkerdistick
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: North Texas
Posts: 881
This is regarding my intended new buried 30 ft service line from meter to house:

I've been doing some reading on PEX systems and it seems to me that the Uponor Aquapex is consistently seen as one of the most reliable systems, in particular because of the less restrictive expansion fitting with the non-metallic ring on the outside.

I could get 100 ft. of the 1 in Aquapex for $130 plus another $20 or so for copper adapters on supplyhouse.com. The only thing then is the expansion tool which is $400 new (including 1/2, 3/4 and 1 in heads). I've seen someone locally sell his new set for $300. If I could get a used one for that price, I'd probably be able to sell it for a bit less. It doesn't seem there are any local rentals available in my area. Plus, my plumbing supply store carries Viega and not Uponor. There's also the Apollo-branded manual expansion tool but reviews suggest that while it works well for 1/2 in PEX, it is much harder to expand 1 in tubing manually. Even though I only have to make two expansion joints, I can't afford messing those up, obviously.

I am afraid if I hire a plumber, they will balk at my idea of using a system that isn't stocked by the local supply store.

I also like that PEX A is the most flexible, so would likely be doing well pushing through my planned 2 in PVC conduit (even though that isn't really a worry of mine).

I've thought some more about the Pex-Al-Pex but I don't think I would be getting a product that would perform better in a buried application. Or would I?

What do you all think? The OCD is strong with this one, I am afraid.
__________________
Wolfgang
makethatkerdistick is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-06-2020, 07:30 PM   #58
makethatkerdistick
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: North Texas
Posts: 881
Trying to put a 2 in hole in my concrete foundation and unsure what drill bit to purchase.
I have a Boschhammer with SDS max chuck. Need to get through 4 in of concrete with possibly hitting rebar.

Should I use this:
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Bosch-2-...E&gclsrc=aw.ds

Or could I get away with this:
https://www.zoro.com/bosch-sds-max-c...iABEgLrPPD_BwE

Or is there a cheaper alternative? Like drilling small holes in a circular fashion and then trying to knock out the center?

I want to avoid chipping the concrete as this hole will be inside a wall cavity. There is a finished tile floor on one side of the wall. Trying to keep it neat and clean.
__________________
Wolfgang
makethatkerdistick is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-06-2020, 07:56 PM   #59
cx
Moderator emeritus
 
cx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Boerne, Texas
Posts: 89,558
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfgang
Need to get through 4 in of concrete with possibly hitting rebar.
If you're trying to make a neat hole, you'll wanna avoid the part where you hit the rebar, Wolfgang. Your expensive drill bit is not gonna like it at all, and it's not gonna drill through it.

I'd opt for the 2" bit in your first link. I don't have a 2" bit for my SDS-Max, but I've got a 1 3/4" and it will quite happily drill through 4 inches of old concrete with relative ease and it makes a pretty neat hole. You will have a little bit of blow-out on the output side, but shouldn't be a problem unless you're gonna paint the hole and call it a feature.

I've never tried a core bit similar to your second link, but I can see it being a real PITA when trying to go through 4 inches of concrete. Drill a little, chisel a little. Drill a little, chisel a little. Wish you'd paid the extra $60. Drill a little.....
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfgang
I want to avoid chipping the concrete as this hole will be inside a wall cavity.
'Fraid I don't understand that part.

You can, of course, drill a bunch of half-inch holes around the perimeter of your desired 2" diameter hole and chip out the rest, but not while you "avoid chipping the concrete." But if I were a fella who didn't think I'd ever again have use of that 2-inch bit and I already had smaller bits, and I could live with a raggedy lookin' hole, that's likely the method I'd chose.

Also don't understand the part about the tile floor. Some plywood or similar on the tile floor should keep any hole drilling debris from doing any harm, no?

My opinion; worth price charged.
__________________
CX

Y'ALL NEW VISITORS READ THIS HERE!
cx is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-06-2020, 09:10 PM   #60
makethatkerdistick
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: North Texas
Posts: 881
Thanks, CX. Let me clarify: I am bringing my 1 in PEX water line into the house. It will enter under the slab and inside a wall cavity of an interior wall where it'll connect to my copper line (which then goes into the attic to the distribution network). I will have to drill through the 2x4 bottom plate with a regular wood bit and then drill through the concrete underneath. On the other side of that wall cavity is a finished tile floor, hence I can't just use my chipping bit. I am afraid I'd accidentally break off too much concrete.

The first drill bit to which I linked (and which you seemed to like) also features "concrete with rebar" as possible application. Not sure if that means it would cut through such rebar or not. Perhaps that description is misleading. My preference would be to avoid any rebar.

Thinking of it now, I might even get away with a smaller hole, say 1 3/4 in or even 1 1/2 in. I just figured that a 2 inch hole gives me a bit more wiggle room when fishing in the PEX tubing.

I ordered 1 in Uponor Aquapex tubing together with a manual expander from Supplyhouse. It'll take some muscle to expand those 1 in fittings but I only have two such fittings to accomplish (one in the wall and one at the meter) and don't feel the need for the electric tool. I've been doing lots of pull-ups and push-ups in anticipation of the manual expansion process.
__________________
Wolfgang
makethatkerdistick is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Stonetooling.com   Tile-Assn.com   National Gypsum Permabase


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ceramic tile floor in 1950's ranch elodublin Tile Forum/Advice Board 5 06-20-2015 09:42 AM
Ranch Bath Tile Project Dmarkie Tile Forum/Advice Board 15 10-14-2014 02:59 PM
Bath Remodel of 1960's Ranch In Connecticut Philip in Connecticut Tile Forum/Advice Board 5 01-12-2009 03:17 PM
Ed's 1956 Ranch Master Bathroom Renovation Ed_S Tile Forum/Advice Board 21 11-13-2007 05:01 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:37 AM.


Sponsors

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2018 John Bridge & Associates, LLC