Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile

Welcome to John Bridge / Tile Your World, the friendliest DIY Forum on the Internet


Advertiser Directory
JohnBridge.com Home
Buy John Bridge's Books

Go Back   Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile > Tile & Stone Forums > Tile Forum/Advice Board

Sponsors


Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Unread 09-20-2021, 09:11 PM   #46
Skivvt
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Vermont
Posts: 40
Thanks cx, wondering if it makes any since to add another sister on the other side even if it didn’t go as far as the green on, maybe that is starting to add more weight than necessary.

I was planning on adding some blocking between the joists as needed.

As far as the offset, it is actually 13” from the stud right now, I thought about doing the furring but there is a hot water baseboard on the one wall next to the toilet but it might still work…thinking about it there isn’t really a reason why it won’t work just need to detail it right to fit the base board nicely and it will solve a massive issue so thanks for making me think about it a little more.

Thanks for the comment on the graphics, it’s not 100% accurate and as detailed as i would like it but it really helps visualize what is going on..
__________________
Mark
Skivvt is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-21-2021, 08:34 AM   #47
cx
Moderator emeritus
 
cx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Boerne, Texas
Posts: 93,835
If your sister covers the center thirds of your joist span, it should be OK. Best I can tell looking back through your thread, that sister would need to be about seven feet long extending from one end. If you can do that, I wouldn't think the second sister would be of much value. And if you can't, the second sister would be of even less value. Judgment call on the part of the guy who is onsite.

It appears your unsupported joist span is less than ten feet and I wouldn't bother with any blocking, but you certainly can if you want. Cross-bracing is better than solid blocking if you elect to do the blocking.

My opinion; worth price charged.
__________________
CX

Y'ALL NEW VISITORS READ THIS HERE!
cx is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-21-2021, 08:51 AM   #48
Skivvt
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Vermont
Posts: 40
Thanks, the unsupported span is about 140” and I think i can squeak in a 120” sister so I should be good.

I do have 2 wires passing through the joists that are in the way, one of them I will be able to pull and rerun to the switch the other I will more than likely need to cut , luckily the wire when cut appears to be long enough to put in a box facing the other room
__________________
Mark
Skivvt is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-29-2021, 03:54 PM   #49
Skivvt
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Vermont
Posts: 40
Hoping to get some feedback on this tonight.

So i am well into the demo, I thought my tile guy was scheduled for the 11th but turns out it is the 4th - yikes - so it’s gona be balls to the walls till then…

So I need to pad out on either side so subfloor is supported , the side shown is the side the shower will be on, seams the most expedient way would be to glue and screw 2 2x4’s with construction screws, do you think thats adequate or is there a better way maybe a 2x6 then 2x4?

On the other side the wall is practically flush with the joist so it would only take 1 2x4 or 2x6

Thoughts?
Attached Images
   
__________________
Mark
Skivvt is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-29-2021, 05:47 PM   #50
cx
Moderator emeritus
 
cx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Boerne, Texas
Posts: 93,835
Properly executed, that should be adequate, Mark.

My opinion; worth price charged.
__________________
CX

Y'ALL NEW VISITORS READ THIS HERE!
cx is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-29-2021, 07:09 PM   #51
Skivvt
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Vermont
Posts: 40
Thanks cx,

Question on the subfloor so for the 3/4” t&g should be no lower than a B grade with waterproof glue and the 1/2” the same minus the t&g?
__________________
Mark
Skivvt is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-29-2021, 07:13 PM   #52
cx
Moderator emeritus
 
cx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Boerne, Texas
Posts: 93,835
Correct except that you can go as low as C on the grade. Usually some BC or AC available at your local home center. Might wanna stop by the bank first.

My opinion; worth price charged.
__________________
CX

Y'ALL NEW VISITORS READ THIS HERE!
cx is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-29-2021, 08:57 PM   #53
Skivvt
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Vermont
Posts: 40
Perfect, thanks cx

So I am going to try to use full 3/4” sheets for the subfloor but gota tell you not so confident i will be able to wrestle them up the steps and over a railing.

If I have to cut them you had mentioned earlier to make sure to span a min of 3 joists so my question is…

I have 7 joists (2 are on the far right left wall that i still need to install) so i could cut to fit the ply for 4 joists and 3 joists - would it be best to alternate so the seam isn’t in line front to back of the room? Or would it matter, meaning just lay all the 4 joist pieces on the left and the 3 joist pieces on the right for example.

Attached is a pic of the space, shower on the left, vanity’s on the right, if i cut my gut feel says put the 4 joist pieces on the right as that is where most of the walking will occur if that makes any sense


And in the end will it affect the stiffness, stability, subfloor for tile if I cut the panels, guess i am trying to gauge how much I should try to kill myself getting a full sheet up there.
Attached Images
 
__________________
Mark
Skivvt is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-29-2021, 09:21 PM   #54
cx
Moderator emeritus
 
cx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Boerne, Texas
Posts: 93,835
I would always want full sheets if possible, Mark, but the situation frequently dictates otherwise. Yes, for sure you want to stagger the joints if you elect to cut the sheets for ease of installation.

You can also consider using square-edge sheets if fitting the T&G edges is also a problem, which can occur in remodel work. You would need to provide blocking between the sheets in the joist bays, but that's easily done as well.

If you glue and screw your cut pieces, you should really not suffer much since you'll be putting a second layer of subfloor over the cuts.

But if you can get full sheets in there, I'd do that. Keep in mind that you'll want the sheets to be at least 1/2" smaller than the width of the room (1/4" or so gap on each side), which can be helpful in fitting large pieces in small spaces. Yeah, it's still a PITA wrestling full 4x8 sheets of 3/4" plywood into such an area, 'specially if, like me, you're not a large person to begin with and not nearly as young as once you were.

You have perhaps a very large friend who could help for the short time it will take to install those pieces?

My opinion; worth price charged.
__________________
CX

Y'ALL NEW VISITORS READ THIS HERE!
cx is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-30-2021, 08:11 AM   #55
Skivvt
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Vermont
Posts: 40
So in checking the floor i have one joist a little low like a good 1/4” so i was thinking I would just sister on another joist but can only do on one side due to the plumbing stack as the new joist would not sit on the the header. I could put it on the plumbing side if.

1. It’s ok for the vent to be slightly out of plumb, (I don’t think it’s a problem but not sure)
2. It’s ok if I don’t plug the previous notch for the toilet which i had planned on doing after sistering the joist. Was going to plug for extra insurance but maybe I don’t need to?

Also just realized that I could potentially mill a strip to go on top of the existing joist although if it’s tapered could be tricky to ge right

Thanks
Attached Images
    
__________________
Mark

Last edited by Skivvt; 09-30-2021 at 08:22 AM.
Skivvt is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-30-2021, 09:30 AM   #56
cx
Moderator emeritus
 
cx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Boerne, Texas
Posts: 93,835
No need for sister to sit on the support structure if it's only meant for flattening. A straight 2x4 or 2x6 (I always prefer 2x6, just for fastening advantage) will be adequate. You'll be extending the joist spacing on one side, but with your double layer subfloor that won't matter.

No need to try to fill the hole in a butchered joist after sistering the joist for strength and rigidity. Won't help.

I can't imagine any inspector paying any attention to an out of plumb vent pipe.



My opinion; worth price charged.
__________________
CX

Y'ALL NEW VISITORS READ THIS HERE!
cx is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-30-2021, 11:59 AM   #57
Skivvt
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Vermont
Posts: 40
So at the lumber store… no t&g and really don’t want to do blocking can advantec be used? 3/4 t&g and 1/2”. The keep trying to tell me thats what should be ised but I know to check here first!

Borg and the blue one do not have it either

Anxiously awating….
__________________
Mark
Skivvt is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-30-2021, 01:50 PM   #58
cx
Moderator emeritus
 
cx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Boerne, Texas
Posts: 93,835
The Advantec would be fine for the first layer, but I'd still favor plywood for the top layer rather than OSB, 'specially if you plan to bond anything to it. Technically it would be suitable for both layers, though.

My opinion; worth price charged.
__________________
CX

Y'ALL NEW VISITORS READ THIS HERE!
cx is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-30-2021, 02:32 PM   #59
Skivvt
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Vermont
Posts: 40
Thanks for the quick reply cx, so a couple more questions

1. If i went with 3/4 advantec and 1/2” ply there is no seasonal movement issues between the 2 different materials to matter? I only ask because I thought I read somewhere that they should both be the same material.

2. Is the screw holding sufficient 1/2” ply to the advantec, I haven’t used the stuff before.

3. So I would like to use the advantec and the 1/2” ply however if the experts here really feel that the 3/4 ply with 1/2 ply will provide superior results them perhaps I should reconsider. The thought of putting all that blocking in…argh..
__________________
Mark
Skivvt is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-30-2021, 02:55 PM   #60
jadnashua
Veteran DIYer- Schluterville Graduate

STAR Senior Contributor

 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Nashua, NH
Posts: 14,583
1. When properly attached, in the end, both products are primarily wood. FWIW, not all OSB sheets are created equal. I've not had any issues with bonding to Advantec...some of the others have a waxy coating, and yes, that can be an issue.
2. The issue I have with Advantec and trying to screw into it, is that the stuff is REALLY dense, and the screw doesn't always start immediately, leading to screw jacking. You might find that a pilot hole helps prevent that. The type of screw used can make a difference, as some start their own hole better than others. You need each layer to be tightly snugged up against each other, and you can do that with either a through hole in the top sheet, or a pilot hole in the bottom so that they can 'float' on the shank and clamp together.
3. Two layers will always be stiffer than one when properly installed. But, Advantec is at least 10% stiffer than the same thickness plywood, and is enough, unless you want to add height in the room. Keep in mind, the load design is 50psi, and that includes everything above the joists, so adding more structure means less room for live loading.

I should have mentioned this before, but the rubber couplings used are NOT approved for above ground use...you MUST use a shielded coupling. You might have to go to a plumbing supply store to get the right one to attach copper to PVC, as each OD is different...those sold in the big box stores are sized for PVC on both ends. You should also be careful about torquing the screw clamp properly.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Fernco-P...-100372287-_-N
Code requires the outlets in a bathroom to be 20A dedicated GFCI to THAT room only. Previously, they allowed for sharing bathrooms to one circuit (which I think is dumb), and that's the way mine was wired back in the 1980's.
__________________
Jim DeBruycker
Not a pro, multiple Schluter Workshops (Schluterville and 2013 and 2014 at Schluter Headquarters), Mapei Training 2014, Laticrete Workshop 2014, Custom Building Products Workshop 2015, and Longtime Forum Participant.
jadnashua is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Stonetooling.com   Tile-Assn.com   National Gypsum Permabase


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Mark's Shower drake4646 Tile Forum/Advice Board 24 03-14-2019 07:27 AM
Mark's shower project with hot mopped pan and cast iron shower drain halfdome Tile Forum/Advice Board 20 05-03-2017 01:20 PM
Mark-ma Shower carrud Tile Forum/Advice Board 34 12-22-2014 11:17 AM
Mark's new shower the-mark Tile Forum/Advice Board 8 02-18-2011 01:30 PM
Mark's shower/tub surround Markinbama Tile Forum/Advice Board 25 07-24-2009 01:29 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:17 AM.


Sponsors

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2018 John Bridge & Associates, LLC