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Unread 01-29-2006, 10:34 PM   #1
bobcat
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Waterproof the shower

Hi everyone,

I'm new to this forum and am a novice in bathroom remodeling. You guys give me a lot of precious information about building a shower the right way.

I'm in the middle of building a mortar shower and need some clarification about waterproof it (This topic has been touched on so many times and I hope it's not too boring ).

1. If I put the water resistant building paper (from fortifiber) behind the Hardi, I shouldn't put on waterproof membrane, like redgard, laticrete 9235. Is that correct?
2. I shouldn't put on waterproof membrane on the final mortar bed floor before tiling since the building paper has already been laid under the pre-slope mortar bed. Is that correct?
3. I was planning to put in the prefabricated niche. After I cut open the Hardi, should I cut open the building paper behind? I was afraid the water-resistant function is reduced by cut open the building paper. However, if I don't cut it open, I can't put in the niche. Any idea?
4. I'll also put the frameless glass on the curb. However, the curb is slope towards the drain. Is it going to be an issue when installing the glass since the curb isn't flat?


Thank you!
Vincent
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Unread 01-29-2006, 10:48 PM   #2
Theoderik
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Hi Vincent and welcome.

You're doing great!

1 - correct. do NOT put on another waterproof membrane like RedGard. NOT good. With a vapor barrier behind the CBU, it's perfect!

2 - Yes- do NOT put anything on the mudbed before tiling. (sidenote - you did leave your weepholes open, right? Put spacers or pea-gravel or something around the drain?

3 - Niches are lot's of fun. Yes- cut out your CBU. Cut open your vapor barrier. Install your niche. Then RedGard the HECK out of it. RedGard the niche and the sides and then outside the niche on your wall about 6-8 inches out from the niche all around. Put on at LEAST two coats. Four would be ok, too.

4 - Your slope shouldn't be real noticable so it should be fine.
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Unread 01-29-2006, 11:23 PM   #3
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Welcome, Vincent.

Mostly what Shawn said.

But on #2, let's clarify:
Quote:
2. I shouldn't put on waterproof membrane on the final mortar bed floor before tiling since the building paper has already been laid under the pre-slope mortar bed. Is that correct?
The building paper under the pre-slope has nothing at all to do with waterproofing the shower floor. You did install a proper pan liner in a clamping drain and all, did you not?

Have you read everything in the Shower Construction section of the Liberry?

My opinion; worth price charged.
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Unread 01-30-2006, 12:15 AM   #4
bobcat
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Thank you so much for your quick respond. I've been reading the Shower Construction section and it has the most valuable information I need. I'll start my work this week and will keep you posted.

This is a great forum and you guys are awesome
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Unread 01-30-2006, 12:40 AM   #5
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Is that a yes? (grin)
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Unread 01-31-2006, 12:31 PM   #6
bobcat
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I got couple more questions:

1. Any tips about laying 6" tiles within the sloped-shower? It seems to be tricky. If that's the case, I'll just go with 2" tiles.

2. My General Contractor installed the shower drain for me but it looked differerent from the one in the instruction. The top piece is 2 inch high. Is it the right part? Attached picture shows the drain piece.


He laid the liner but WITHOUT pre-slope and used the carpet to dryout the liner after the leak test : I'm glad I caught him before he put on the mortar.

3. How do you plug the drain for the leak test?


Thanks!
Vincent
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Unread 01-31-2006, 12:39 PM   #7
bbcamp
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1) Yes, it's tricky. That's why we recommend 2 to 3 inch tiles for this.

2) I guess it is the right part. Can you find out who made it?

3) Get an inflatible plumber's test plug, and insert it down the drain to below the weepholes. A kid's party balloon will also work, you can pop it when you are done. Tell Mrs. Vincent to have the camera ready when you insert it into the drain and blow it up.
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Unread 02-01-2006, 03:11 AM   #8
johnrocas
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As long as we're talking about vapor barriers....

Do you have to have a vapor barrier behind the CBU? What is redgaurd and will it be sufficient for a vapor barrier?

Thanks, John
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Unread 02-01-2006, 07:48 AM   #9
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Hi John, yes you need a vapor barrier. Either use tap paper or 4 to 6 mil poly. If you use redgard on the face you don't want the poly or tar paper behind. Redgard is a roll on or trowel on or brush on waterproof membrane when it has dried.
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Unread 02-01-2006, 10:21 AM   #10
Binkley
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Musky,

Are you saying that you could put something like the Hardibacker directly over studs w/o vapor barrier and then just simply roll on a product to the outside of the backer prior to tiling?

Sorry. I'm very new to tiling in a wet environment.

Joe
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Unread 02-01-2006, 10:26 AM   #11
Theoderik
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Yes Joe.

In my shower, I ripped it down to studs and then put up CBU. I THEN found this site and found out I should have had a vapor barrier behind my CBU. I did not want to take it all off and apply one so, after some discussion and questions here, I bought a gallon of RedGard ($37.00 at Home Depot) and rolled 2 coats on my shower. I then tiled directly to that.

Here is a pic....
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Unread 02-01-2006, 10:30 AM   #12
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Joe, the vapor barrier behind the backerboard is simpler, cheaper and less messy than a paint-on membrane on the surface. I'm sure Shawn will agree.
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Unread 02-01-2006, 12:14 PM   #13
johnrocas
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Unfortunately, I am in Theo's position and have already put up the CBU so I will be investing in the redgard.

THanks for the answers!
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Unread 02-01-2006, 12:19 PM   #14
Scooter
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I prefer Laticrete 9235 over poly. I mean place the membrane as far North as you can--it avoids sopping wet backerboards and really bullet proofs a shower.

And another tip, if you use 9235 there is a fiberglass mat that is applied and overlapped. This forms a monolithic unit that resists expansion so you can generally grout corners rather than caulk them.
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Unread 02-01-2006, 04:48 PM   #15
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Side note - yes to Bob. IF I was able to do it over again - I would have put the poly on behind it. UGH. But, it's done now. WHOPEE!
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