Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile

Welcome to John Bridge / Tile Your World, the friendliest DIY Forum on the Internet


Advertiser Directory
JohnBridge.com Home
Buy John Bridge's Books

Go Back   Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile > Tile & Stone Forums > Professionals' Hangout

Sponsors


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 01-27-2013, 07:45 PM   #1546
Hank B.
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Waunakee, WI
Posts: 1,418
I should probably mention that I'm a newb on the mud scene though, But Davy is definately not, so since he agrees, I'll probably still feel the same way in 10 yrs from now. I actually need some new screeds. Especially since I just finished my last backer board shower, Hopefully. I shim and I plumb and I plane and I still don't get flat walls with backerboard. Think i'm done with it for good. maybe, sort of. Never tried k-board though.
__________________
Hank
Hank B. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 07:48 PM   #1547
cx
Da Home Builder
 
cx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Boerne, Texas
Posts: 88,122
Glad Davy mentioned cuttin' those screeds. Buy two sets of the L-shaped ones right outa the chute and cut half a foot off one set. Later you'll likely cut some of'em some more.

If you're using eight or ten-footers or longer to pull deck mud, I like the box screeds. But for showers and smaller deck mud, I still prefer the L-shaped. Can use the short side to make your screed line and then pull with the long side and be able to see under'em real well. 'Specially useful when you get where seeing ain't as easy as it usta be.

Just did a shower the other day with box screeds and kept trying to tilt it up on a corner so's I could see if it was touchin' Still don't know if it's flat.
__________________
CX

Y'ALL NEW VISITORS READ THIS HERE!
cx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 08:27 PM   #1548
Hamilton
Bucket abuser
 
Hamilton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Wildomar Ca
Posts: 9,177
L-edges can scoop and dump excess mud also
__________________
Jack Hamilton

Hamiltontileandstone.com

Temecula Tile and Natural stone contractor
Hamilton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 09:06 PM   #1549
jwmezzanotte
Registered User
 
jwmezzanotte's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Prince Rupert BC Canada
Posts: 2,141
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamilton
L-edges can scoop and dump excess mud also
This is what I'm thinking.
I have much experience with a screed on concrete slabs. I notice a wider (thicker?) screed does pull up material on concrete as well when you lift it up, although thats not a problem in that case.
I don't plan to be running a bull-float over a wall though
but maybe just for fun?
jwmezzanotte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2013, 09:20 PM   #1550
Hamilton
Bucket abuser
 
Hamilton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Wildomar Ca
Posts: 9,177
When I use an L-edge for wall mud, the thin side of the edge cuts the mud. The mud slides back to the L and is dumped back onto a mud board, or into a bucket. Keeping the edge near perpendicular to the mud is key, because the edge can bend and dig in if it is laid down at too much of an angle. The weight of the mud collecting will make the center sag, and dish the cut.

Working with deck mud, I use the L side for cutting, leveling and shaping. It is much stiffer and also the reason many prefer box edges for deck mud. If you learn how to use the edges you have either are fine in my own opinion.
__________________
Jack Hamilton

Hamiltontileandstone.com

Temecula Tile and Natural stone contractor
Hamilton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 08:35 AM   #1551
John Bridge
Mudmeister
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Rosanky, Texas
Posts: 67,629
Send a message via AIM to John Bridge
I've used 'em all, but mostly I used old fashion wood boards of every description -- 1x4s, 1x6s, 2x6s, whatever was handy and straight. Wood boards work well, and can be easily cut when you need shorter pieces. But I have to admit that straight boards are a rare sight nowadays.

Jack, the L-edges must be getting a lot thinner. Back in the day I had no problem with the thin edge bowing. Back in the day was a long time ago, though.
John Bridge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 06:58 PM   #1552
bulldog tile
Registered User
 
bulldog tile's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Jackson, MS
Posts: 920
I agree with the consensus - L shaped for wall mud and box for floor mud. Like Jack and Davy I like the way L shaped straight edges cut the mud and then collect it to dump on the table. I do set my screed sticks with a box and level and I still shape my curbs with a box but everything else is done with the L's.

I have a set of L shaped straight edges that I bought more than 30 years ago that I still use amost every day. They're a little rough around the edges but still work well. Even though I clean them religiously they still have some deposits on them from years gone by.
__________________
Donnie

I dream of a better tomorrow, where chickens can cross the road without having their motives questioned.
Ralph Waldo Emerson
bulldog tile is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 09:16 PM   #1553
Davy
Moderator -- Mud Man
 
Davy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Princeton,Tx.- Dallas area
Posts: 31,584
I've had both sets of my L screeds for about 20 years. I have had to straighten the edges a couple times. Especially the 5 ft edge that is used so much on tub surrounds, the edges tend to wear a little on the ends from riding on the wood sticks. A belt sander takes care of it pretty fast.
__________________
Davy

www.davystephenstile.com
Davy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 10:04 PM   #1554
Hamilton
Bucket abuser
 
Hamilton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Wildomar Ca
Posts: 9,177
I have a mixed set of L-edges. Custom sizes from multiple sets cut down. Some even inherited from other setters. I have noticed that the older edges were made with better quality. My first set was never hacked up, and is still to this day my best metal =)
__________________
Jack Hamilton

Hamiltontileandstone.com

Temecula Tile and Natural stone contractor
Hamilton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2013, 03:56 PM   #1555
Davy
Moderator -- Mud Man
 
Davy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Princeton,Tx.- Dallas area
Posts: 31,584
Yeah, I've seen the newer edges, much thinner than the ones I have.
__________________
Davy

www.davystephenstile.com
Davy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2013, 06:46 AM   #1556
TonE
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 183
I probably have 7 or 8 of the plaster feather edges the ones with the little finger slots on em. I like them the best for the wall mud.They are thinner an cut thru the mud nicer.Than the L shaped aluminum edges...Like mentioned the hollowing out in the center is more so caused buy the mud dragging an pulling product off the wall in the process..I like to hold them perpendicular to leaned back a little..with a little shimmy to help the cut..Just a little or your playing with yourself..Haha
After a while you will find there are "standard " sizes you will need for say 5' tub a 36,42 an 48" shower an so on.I have a coupla 6 fters.for big walls.It's nice to set the sticks 4 ft apart or so an go like mad..Haven't done much of it lately..i miss it..
Mud floor screeds are all magnesium..Same thing with the sizing..like 58 56 70 you geth the idea.I have two big ones like 9'8" for the big runs..Lighter than the aluminum taller also.You don't have to bend over so much..They cut good not as sharpe as the aluminum not as blendy as a pc of wood..All my edges are over 25 yrs old..The wall screeds have some wear in them,they still make a way better product than wallboard systems..the floor screeds have held up great..
Recently I was in a house i did 24 years ago..I spent over a year on this project..Full tiles in every room no cuts type of job..
One bath was 4x4 bottle blue glass tiles an black absolute granite..It still looked awesoem not ONE grout joint opened up..Amazing.Modern technolgy steel and framing made to hold the load an old world setting methods lead to a job that will stand the test of time..It was delitefull to see..
Supporting the load is something all you mud wall wannabe's have to consider in your remodels..It deserves more merit than it gets..I remember we toyed with perlite or some kinda styrofoam used in conjuntion with the sand for a lighter mix..It was nice if you have to build the tops out more than usual..The extra mud did not want to peel from the load in the installation..
__________________
Tyler
TonE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2013, 05:19 PM   #1557
bulldog tile
Registered User
 
bulldog tile's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Jackson, MS
Posts: 920
Tyler, thanks for the input. Do you have pictures of these straight edges that you speak of? I guess I live a sheltered life, I'm not familar with them. Kinda curious. May have to get me a couple to try out.

Thanks.
__________________
Donnie

I dream of a better tomorrow, where chickens can cross the road without having their motives questioned.
Ralph Waldo Emerson
bulldog tile is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2013, 06:55 PM   #1558
tilejoe
Registered User
 
tilejoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Allentown, Bethlehem, Easton, PA
Posts: 2,302
Funny those edges came up. Just saw one for the first time yesterday. They look like a giant edge for paint. Opposite the cutting edge has hand holes.
__________________
Joe Lenner

Infinite Ceramic & Stone
www.infiniteceramic.com
NTCA Pennsylvania State Rep
CTEF Certified Installer #769
tilejoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2013, 07:48 PM   #1559
jwmezzanotte
Registered User
 
jwmezzanotte's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Prince Rupert BC Canada
Posts: 2,141
So I now have my first one under my belt.

I have three days into this job so far, but that includes building the curb, figureing out layout, boarding around the tub, installing heat cable, and priming the floor and pouring Ardex Liquid backerboard. Also spent almost half the first day getting material, and trying to find Lath in town. Apparently its not used much here...

So far my hours in the shower are 4hrs prep. Poly and lath.
2hrs scratch
5hrs brown.
So 11 hrs in the mud so far.
How am I doing for a newb?

I dropped one full 5 gal pail of mud, that was including what I dropped screeding the mud with a 1x4 (still dont have any straightedges) I did find the wood screeds pulled a bit of mud off. I think I'll have better luck when I get some L edges. Once I figured out to "saw" the mud rather than pull, I found I was pulling out almost no mud. Much better.

Of course for my first one I had to pick a shower with a bench and a bunch of sprayers to work around
So far I'm enjoying it, except I have a nagging cold that won't go away and I'm pretty tired. I found this to be really hard work, I'm sure it is, but I think a bit of it had to do with the cold.

Some pictures
Attached Images
     
jwmezzanotte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2013, 08:20 PM   #1560
Davy
Moderator -- Mud Man
 
Davy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Princeton,Tx.- Dallas area
Posts: 31,584
Yeah but shimming and trying to get CBU flat, plumb and square is frustrating work. I'll take the hard work over that any day. I think you're timing is fine.

Zig zag the straight edge as you go up the walls, that helps cut the mud.

I have mudded several walls 8 ft wide and one in my bathroom is 13 ft wide. I set a third stick in the middle to mud it. My box edges are also magnesium, 1 1/2 ft thru 12 ft long. The 10 and 12 footers were my dad's, over 40 years old. Of course they don't get used much.
__________________
Davy

www.davystephenstile.com
Davy is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Stonetooling.com   Tile-Assn.com   National Gypsum Permabase


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
mud work larrylou Professionals' Hangout 117 10-30-2011 02:33 PM
Where's that mud work how to thread? MGB Creative Tile Tile Forum/Advice Board 4 09-18-2008 05:26 PM
Mud work Rd Tile The Mud Box 2 04-16-2008 08:10 PM
Mud Work Charles P Professionals' Hangout 2 01-11-2008 07:33 PM
Methods for finding commercial work K_Tile Professionals' Hangout 23 10-31-2002 04:57 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:04 PM.


Sponsors

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2018 John Bridge & Associates, LLC