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Old 05-21-2019, 12:21 PM   #1
JSrenovations
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Mud Bed. Technique for installing dry then spraying with water?

I am not sure if it was here or another site but I recall reading that there was a newer "technique" to creating a dry pack mud bed by first installing the totally dry blended mixture of sand/cement - and then only at the end to spray it with water so that it cures.

Is anyone familiar with this and can share their knowledge and experience?

Thank you.
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Old 05-21-2019, 12:45 PM   #2
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I think you're talking about Paul's "Houston mud method".
https://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin...ht=Houston+mud
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Old 05-21-2019, 01:06 PM   #3
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I learned this from Paul...and I use it exclusively with Kerdi showers. No mixing, no lugging buckets and much cleaner, IMHO. Check out the video in the above link.....
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Old 05-21-2019, 04:01 PM   #4
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Thank you.

Can this be used with Mapei 4-to-1?

Can this only be used with Laticrete 3701?

Any other PRE-MIXED mortar bed? I like things very simple.

Thanks!
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Old 05-21-2019, 04:41 PM   #5
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I suppose you can do it with any deck mud you want. In my opinion, mix it with water and get it over with. Adding water to the mix after it's on the floor washes the Portland down to the bottom leaving the surface sandy. Everyone is always looking for a short cut. Do it the way the manufacturer recommends. It's not that difficult. Again, just my opinion.
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Old 05-21-2019, 08:18 PM   #6
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This "Houston Mud Method" is not recognized by the ceramic tile industry as an acceptable method of preparing mortar for floors. Information on the correct method is contained in ANSI A108. The correct industry standard methods should be followed.
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Old 05-22-2019, 07:33 AM   #7
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3.25 Posts a year and THIS is what rouses the Tile Ranger from their slumber?
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Old 05-22-2019, 08:34 AM   #8
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Not really a new method. Did it with my Grandfather probably 50 years ago on some big jobs when I was slave labor. Have done it myself on some outdoor projects in WI and they are all intact, oldest being about 35 years old. Have no idea how newer bag mix products would respond. Know in dollars I can get a dump truck load of sand for 4-5 bags.
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Old 05-23-2019, 07:27 AM   #9
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When I was at MAPEI we tried it with 4 to 1 in the lab and were able to develop reasonably decent compressive strengths. Our lead scientist didn't recommend doing it and if you call MAPEI they won't approve it but if you're willing to do it with 3701, it works with 4 to 1 too.
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Old 05-25-2019, 09:28 AM   #10
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I would never do it. If you canít mix mud and pack it or do it the right way donít do it, go with a foam pan
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Old 05-25-2019, 09:38 AM   #11
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You can do it if you grow up doing it. But your right, it is a touchy thing and you have to have a good feel for it. Personally I wouldn't do it with bag mix because I don't have a feel for it. My oldest job in this area is a 37 year old beach pavilion deck and walk (restoration project) on the shores of Lake Michigan that sits under snow and ice 4-5 months of the year, looks new. Most of todays tile setters don't have a sand pile and a flat bed but that was common till 30 years or so ago.
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Old 05-25-2019, 01:28 PM   #12
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I might consider it for a pre slope but not a shower pan.
I would trust throwing bag mix in a hole and wetting it to hold a mailbox post also.
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Old 05-25-2019, 02:57 PM   #13
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Guess I'm in the other camp, Brian. With this method, I get a very accurate bed and slope. Don't need to be that perfect on a preslope...just so it drains with no birdbaths....but then again, with the screeds left in place, I only use this method for single beds like Kerdi..... More than one way to skin a cat...
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Old 05-25-2019, 04:34 PM   #14
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Its the same method as setting fence posts with dry ceement then adding water to the top.

The disorganized version with 20 helpers

A video of results after using 4 to 1
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Old 05-27-2019, 08:50 PM   #15
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Water content

Using concrete as an analogy, theres really no reason it wont work. Fully half the water thst is used in a batch of concrete is there for workability, it takes a surprisingly small amount of water for concrete to set up.
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