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Unread 03-19-2005, 11:30 AM   #1
ShelleyinNM
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Question Curbless Shower

Checked the old posts and don't see one with exactly my situation.

New construction. Slab on grade. Guest casita. Concrete will be the finish floor. Desert SW. Low humidity.

So, why can't I just slope the slab in the shower area and call it done? Have intentionally designed the shower area to be bigger than necessary to accommodate splash.

What am I forgetting? Efflorescense? Think this would be OK? Why haven't I ever seen it done?
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Unread 03-19-2005, 04:23 PM   #2
Davestone
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The tile isn't waterproof,that's what the pan does,it's like a bath tub..if you don't use a pan, or it's equivelant, water will be leaking into the house.
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Unread 03-19-2005, 07:00 PM   #3
ShelleyinNM
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Sorry Dave, you lost me.

Shelley
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Unread 03-19-2005, 07:48 PM   #4
Davestone
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Look here on the site for shower info and you'll see pictures of a proper shower floor,You can't just put a shower on a consrete floor, you have to have something to trap and keep water.Yo can use a plastic like shower pan material, or Kerdi.There are ways to make a shower without a curb, but that would involve some chipping out of concrete for a slope.
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Unread 03-19-2005, 09:02 PM   #5
ShelleyinNM
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Dave,

Don't want to be a pest, but.....the slab is not yet poured. Thus, my question.

I understand shower pans. I'm a mudwoman thanks to the help I found here.

I see no reason why I can't use the slab as my pan as long as I rough in the drain with this in mind and slope the slab as I finish it. Do you?
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Unread 03-19-2005, 09:24 PM   #6
Hamilton
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Im understanding what youre asking shellie. you want to use the slab with
no tile on the floor right? you may need something to seal the concrete
so that moisture doesnt get into your slab. as a tile guy im not sure how
this would be done. maybe some kind of epoxy coating to seal the slab and
the drain where they meet as well as the entire area that will come into contact
with water. If im understanding you correctly this is what youre asking.
If you do pursue something like this make sure the epoxy coating has a nonslip
texture to it. i would consult as many reference data bases as possible. we will
give you all the tile advice you need but it sounds as though you want to use
the slab with slope to the drain as the finished floor. cool idea let us know if it
works out.
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Unread 03-19-2005, 09:57 PM   #7
cx
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I'm not understanding exactly what you mean to do either, Shelley. When I pour SOG with shower, I drop the shower area 5 1/2 inches (one 2x6 for simplicity of forming). I leave a standard box-out with the drain pipe roughly centered. That allows vertical room for a pre-slope, liner, and mud floor and room for about a two inch step-down and no curb.

But you've still gotta make provisions for the pan liner to run a few inches (at least) above the bottom of your wall framing. Or you could just make the pre-slope and use the Kerdi system.

In any event, you must make provision for the installation of either a clamping drain or a Kerdi drain, and trying to do that successfully as part of the slab pour is gonna be real educational for one of us.

It is so much easier to provide a drop and build it back up where you want it, with the necessary slope and finish. If all you need is the pre-slope and Kerdi, your drop would only need be 1 1/2 inch or so if you want the shower floor to be level with the bathroom floor at the door. But there's still the matter of the waterproofing.

Now, if you plan the shower to be so large that water will never reach any of the walls, and you don't care where water might go if the drain ever backed up, and you don't care if a little water leaks down into the ground where the drain is, and you want it all to look like the same floor, you can do what I think you're suggesting. I'd slope the entire floor (or most of it) to a regular floor drain in that situation. Only place I've ever done that is in an upscale greenhouse. Stained the concrete floor and called it finished. Looked nice. Works fine. But it's not living space, either, and don't nobody care where extra water goes on accounta water goes everywhere in there.

My opinion; worth price charged.
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Unread 03-20-2005, 10:57 AM   #8
ShelleyinNM
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Thanks CX. That's just what I wanted. Some alternatives, some other ways of doing it.

Stepping it down and building it back might be the easiest way go get me where I want to be.

Shelley
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Unread 03-20-2005, 11:26 AM   #9
kateneedshelp
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This sounds a lot like what I did in my house. When I poured the slab, I went really deep under the shower area and formed out a hole about 6" lower than the rest of the bathroom floor (with the drain in there of course).

Then to protect the WALLS I put tar paper and a vinyl liner in there and up the walls quite a-ways. I also laid it up onto the bathroom floor (over that edge) a few inches and glued it down there. Then I troweled mortar down over the liner. I ended up tiling the whole thing, but it would have looked really great as acid etched concrete too.

There are only 2 things I'd do differently. (1) is to set the shower hole MUCH DEEPER than I did. It would have been nicer to be able to make a really thick mortar bed, especially if that's gonna be the finished surface. Also it's nice to be able to sit down in the water. When mine was all finished, the shower "hole" ended up only about 3" deep.
(2) is that when you pour the slab, also make a horizontal 2x4 indentation in the bathroom floor around the edge of the shower hole. This would create a nice space to set the vinyl liner edge and to trowel over it with mortar or whetever. It would help you make a nice finished transition from floor to shower floor.
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Unread 03-20-2005, 12:55 PM   #10
PatK
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I ran across this while looking for something else. It deals with accessible showers, curbless being a primary feature.

"Curbless Showers, An Installation Guide"
http://www.design.ncsu.edu/cud/pubs/...20announce.htm
(find the link for the free PDF download)

by NC State Univ. Center for Universal Design http://www.design.ncsu.edu/cud/

Lots of good info, but I did notice that they don't show a pre-slope under their pan liner. Maybe one of the pros will want to set them straight for their next publication

Good luck,
Pat
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Unread 03-20-2005, 03:58 PM   #11
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Send a message via Yahoo to e3
we have a detail on line.
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