Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile

Welcome to John Bridge / Tile Your World, the friendliest DIY Forum on the Internet


Advertiser Directory
JohnBridge.com Home
Buy John Bridge's Books

Go Back   Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile > Tile & Stone Forums > Professionals' Hangout

Sponsors


Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Unread 11-20-2014, 11:48 PM   #1
chesterflick
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 81
I am going into the hamburger business

I am sure tired of the tile business and arguing with those that don't know. If I have to argue with one more person about using thin set to fix substrate issues I am going to puke on them. I had a person in charge of a project tell me that the 1/2" depression in a mock up bathroom can be installed with thin set and he has seen people use up to 3" of thin set to do tile work. All 500 rooms will be like this. I also argued with the same person on control joints. he told me that if the contractor does not want them then we are obligated not to honor them........ And this guy is in charge of a 2 million dollar project.
Why should I argue? who am I? and why the hell should I care. I care because when a failure happens on a job I got to be the guy that has to go take care of the problem.
I can not stress to everyone in our industry the importance of a pre installation inspection of your walls and floors and to hold the substrate contractor accountable for all issues out of our tolerance. I only deal with commercial jobs but it is also important with residential as well
When someone tells me the old 1/4"in 10' crap I have to help them finish the sentence. Which is 1/4"in 10' and an 1/8th in 1' from the required plane. What is the required plane? walls and floors are basically flat
corners need to be plumb and square. Tile that hits the ceiling should hit a level ceiling. When you tile walls you must check the elevation of the rooms floor. If it runs down hill or uphill would you put the wall tile in at the plane the floor is in? do you cut the base or the first course to make it work or do you bring the out of tolerance floor within tolerance so even the bottom of your base is level so the rest of the wall tile can follow. you can then flash from that elevation to the floor. Sometimes the elevation change is minor but sometimes it awful. And I wont even get into drains and waterproofing. thats a whole other rant.

Its late and I am on a rant because I have to go look at a glass tile job tomorrow that I am being told needs to be torn out because of poor workmanship its 12 large bathrooms. I am just tired of it and told everyone to check the walls before installation but because our whole industry has a subcontractor mentality we hire guys that throw it up ,get a check and move on to the next victim. We cant seem to find enough qualified installers and the biggest is superintendents that know how to run a job. We always seem to get idiots that take it for granted that the tile guy knows what he is doing.
I have been involved in way to many tear outs in the last 5 years and only because the people in charge don't friggin listen. some are no longer in business and some are waiting for that catastrophic failure to put them under they just don't know its coming because of ignorance.
At 58 years old I am thinking about installing again and cannot continue with companies that don't listen. sorry
__________________
Tom
chesterflick is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Unread 11-21-2014, 07:27 AM   #2
Houston Remodeler
Pondering retirement daily

STAR Senior Contributor

 
Houston Remodeler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Houston Texas
Posts: 28,236
So tell us about the burgers....
__________________
Paul1

For when DIY isn't such a good idea...
Houston TX area Kitchen & Bath Remodeling


http://CabotAndRowe.com
Houston Remodeler is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-21-2014, 07:54 AM   #3
John Bridge
Mudmeister
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Rosanky, Texas
Posts: 68,815
Send a message via AIM to John Bridge
Tom,

I have a son who is the hamburger business among other things. It ain't easy either.

I never did a lot of commercial . . . some, but not a lot. I dealt with the same issues you mention, though, and those problems go back to the Middle Ages. Still, we have to keep chipping at them and trying to improve things. It's all we can do.
John Bridge is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-21-2014, 07:19 PM   #4
PetrH
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Chilliwack, B.C.
Posts: 1,405
Tom, I agree 100% with everything you said. The only difference is: I go into every job fully expecting that my substrates will be crap and that I will have to deal with fixing them. I charge accordingly. This makes my bids on the high end, but I'm not hurting for work, so that's all right.
__________________
Petr
PetrH is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-24-2014, 06:16 AM   #5
tilemanct
Tile & Stone
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Northeast/Connecticut
Posts: 2,578
Tom
We have all been there with the rant! I'm on a job where the shower has been replaced 2 times and still leaked to the floor below. Every contractor screwed up from framing to plumbing.
Its not getting better out there. I now bring a laser and straight edges with me on all measures. Amazing what you will find. Why is my bid $2K higher? Here's the wall and floor prep contract along with the specs your concrete and framing contractor forgot to follow for tile installation.
Sit down and watch a weekends worth of home fix-em up shows, and you will see the hundreds of mistakes the fast flippers make. Today you need to access the homeowner or G/C to see what their expectations are. From there you either walk or educate. Someone who is driven by price will never want to hear about floor flatness, wall level, or proper waterproofing methods.
I used to think I had to close every job. Now I choose who I want to work for.
__________________
Dave

CTEF Certified Installer
I lost my hero on 5-21-16 You will be missed. Semper Fi
tilemanct is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-24-2014, 08:49 AM   #6
Art of Stone
VP of Technical and Training MLT System
 
Art of Stone's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 471
You nailed it, Dave.
__________________
Ernie
---------
Lay 'em Right

“Vision without execution is hallucination.”

― Thomas A. Edison

http://www.mltsystem.com
Art of Stone is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-24-2014, 08:36 PM   #7
Carter907
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Alaska
Posts: 72
So I'm two weeks into my first 'real' commercial job and I'm so sick to death of this place that I can't wait to get back to residential. Home owners can be a PITA but at least in general, I don't have 30 guys in my way and walking all over the tile that I just cleaned and prepped for grout.

And at least I don't have to cut around the door jamb because the cheap tin jambs they used had to be installed now and "can't be cut"

Short version, I just grin and bear it. And charge extra. The first bill that's not met in full is when I walk. Don't know exactly how, but I've got 2-3 times more work than I can handle and we're a 6 man crew, but don't get me started on helpers...that's a whole other rant.

I love hamburgers!
__________________
Carter
Carter907 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-24-2014, 08:55 PM   #8
Houston Remodeler
Pondering retirement daily

STAR Senior Contributor

 
Houston Remodeler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Houston Texas
Posts: 28,236
Quote:
Originally Posted by dave
today you need to access the homeowner or g/c to see what their expectations are. From there you either walk or educate. Someone who is driven by price will never want to hear about floor flatness, wall level, or proper waterproofing methods.

bingo !!
__________________
Paul1

For when DIY isn't such a good idea...
Houston TX area Kitchen & Bath Remodeling


http://CabotAndRowe.com
Houston Remodeler is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-24-2014, 10:48 PM   #9
T_Hulse
Tile Contractor
 
T_Hulse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 4,332
"Walk or educate", we all need to get better at both. Tom, there's still plenty of work out there for people who will pay more, AFTER you educate them on the real $ value of doing it right.
__________________
Tom Hulse
Visit my web site here
T_Hulse is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-25-2014, 02:15 AM   #10
Jim Farrell Tiler
dont blame me i didnt vote for him
 
Jim Farrell Tiler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Dunedin New Zealand
Posts: 1,785
no tomato in mine thanks
__________________
Jim
Jim Farrell Tiler is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-26-2014, 04:20 PM   #11
Tilecleaningdude
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 7
The tiling business can be tough..haha better stick to flipping burgers
Tilecleaningdude is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Stonetooling.com   Tile-Assn.com   National Gypsum Permabase


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Business name jwmezzanotte Professionals' Hangout 32 07-01-2013 10:20 AM
How is business? kevjob Professionals' Hangout 31 07-24-2008 03:28 AM
This is the business I should be in Levi the Tile Guy The Mud Box 23 03-06-2006 04:04 PM
anyone want a new business?? krash Professionals' Hangout 2 09-26-2005 04:42 PM
New business JTG Professionals' Hangout 4 06-30-2003 07:36 AM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:50 AM.


Sponsors

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2023, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2018 John Bridge & Associates, LLC