Shower Renovation Questions

[ss3964spd]

More or less, yeah.

But given that you're mixing your water proofing products I would be inclined to use a roll-on membrane for those Kerdi band to Hardie backer seams. And it appears, from here, the Hardie to Hardie seams and fasteners were done with thinset mortar, so I'd roll some liquid membrane on those areas also.

[Tiger Mountain Tile Inc]

We definitely don't agree that you shouldn't flood test and should just start tiling. In fact, I'm a bit surprised this has been the consensus, so far.

For damming the shower, I've found that spray foam works the best. Just spray a bead across, wait maybe an hour, and it should be OK. You should fill up the water so that it covers every corner of the shower but it doesn't need to be an inch deep, in my opinion.

You could also cut strips of waterproof foam backer board and seal them across the opening with Kerdi-fix or another type of waterproof sealant. Maybe even the Hardi backer would work for this?

With spray foam, you can break it with your hands to a certain extent but you'll still have to do some scraping. I don't know a way out of that. It's difficult to seal something against water and have it remove easily.

If it flood tests OK then there is no reason to AquaD the shower pan. You'd only need to do the screw holes and seams on the walls and the floor outside the shower.

[cx]

I'm not at all opposed to a flood test, Jim, what I'm not seeing the sense in is creating a new dam where none will be in normal use and flood testing that. Filling the existing receptor to the maximum level of water that it can hold would strike me as a sufficient test of the drain and anything else below that level. I see no real advantage of creating a dam, or dams in this case, to hold more water than the shower could ever see in the worst case of flooding.

When we build curbed showers, we test them to the top of the potential flood level, right? Why do we not build temporary dams above the existing curb and fill to a level several inches above the curb top? Doesn't make sense to do that, right? How is this situation different?

My opinion; worth price charged.

[Houston Remodeler]

In my fairy city we are required to have a temporary dam at least 2 inches tall with at least one inch of water at the 'curb' for testing purposes only.

The easy way is to use the cheap foam-inna-can to make the curb as it is cured by water. Once the test is over the foam removes easily.

[Tiger Mountain Tile Inc]

The reason to dam is that there's always a low corner and always a high corner.

And with the triple overlaps at the corners that means the water may leak out the sides before it covers any of the corners.

If one corner is 1/16 higher plus it has overlapped fabric you may not be able to get the water within several inches of covering the corner.

That's why containing the water is important.

[cx]

Originally Posted by Jim

And with the triple overlaps at the corners that means the water may leak out the sides before it covers any of the corners.

Which, then, is exactly what would happen if the drain were clogged in use and the shower flooded, Jim.

We know that the top corners of a curbed shower, where the curb meets the walls, is one of the first points of failure in traditional shower receptors. But, as I said before, we do not build a temporary dam on top of the curb in order to flood test those corners.

At some point you must accept that any natural flooding will not reach above a certain point and creating an artificial dam to flood test above that point serves no practical purpose.

My opinion; worth price charged.

[Tiger Mountain Tile Inc]

Originally Posted by cx

At some point you must accept that any natural flooding will not reach above a certain point and creating an artificial dam to flood test above that point serves no practical purpose.

But what is that point? When the shower glass is installed that will create a dam. Even if there is a door on both sides there would still be a small stationary panel next to each door.

What if those panels are on the low side(s) of the shower? They will hold some water. Also, does the door have a sweep at the bottom? How much water does that hold back?

Also, if there is only one door on one side and a stationary panel from wall-to-wall on the other then that would hole water also.

Finally, water will only go as far as the shower glass. It will hit the glass and roll down to the corner. So the corners will see a good amount of water. Why not test what you can?

I just don't see why we wouldn't recommend a flood test to cover all 4 corners. Especially, if the advice in the shallow end is supposed to "keep the safety guards on".

[cx]

I saw no indication that there was to be any enclosure on either side of that shower, Jim. Perhaps I missed it somewhere?

[nelsonxn]

Hello,
I'm ready to start tiling my curbless shower front and rear walls. I'm using 16" x 32" X 3/8" large format porcelain tiles w/ a 1/2" notched trowel.

I'm considering cutting the outside corner tiles edges on a 45 to create a look of solid marble around the outer edges of the shower walls. my questions are...

1 - how do i calculate the length of tile i will need beyond the wall edge to accommodate the mortar and tile thickness for the adjacent 45 degree cut tile. I think it would be the 3/8" tile thickness plus a 1/4" for the compresses mortar. Am i correct?

2 - would i be better off just spending the extra bucks and use the aluminum corners and edges instead?

thanks

[cx]

Nelson, it'll help if you'll keep all your project questions on one thread so folks can see what you're working on and what's been previously asked and answered. A moderator can give it a more generic title if you'd like to suggest one.

1. If you plan to butt the tiles together in those corners (not a particularly good idea), you'd need the distance of the thickness of your tile plus compensation for the mortar thickness, which you won't know until you set and measure a couple of your tiles. Safest method, to my thinking, would be to start at those corners and fit the tiles as necessary.

2. That would be entirely up to you and Mrs. Nelson. A dramatically different look than your proposed back-beveled corners.

My opinion; worth price charged.

[nelsonxn]

My apologies, I will comply.

While it is the same project, this thread was about damming the shower floor. I didn't think it would be proper to talk about another subject in the same thread. I guess i was wrong. no problem.

So, in that light, I used two pieces of cement board for the dam walls, coated them with Aqua Defense and sealed the edges with a very thin bead of Flex Shot. After a successful 24 hour test, i removed the dam boards and shaved off the thin bead of silicon. below is an image of the dam flood test.

[nelsonxn]

Now that i can proceed with tiling, I'd like to bevel the shower wall tile corners on a 45 degree angle. It's my first time trying beveled corners and i may end up buying aluminum corners if beveling the corners proves to be too much.

Since i'm using a 1/2 notched trowel, i'm expecting about 3/16" to 1/4" of compressed mortar. So with 3/8" large format porcelain tiles, minus 1/8, plus the mortar, i think the corner tiles should extend beyond the wall corner about 7/16" to 1/2". Am i totally wrong?

I'm thinking i should do a small test to see what the compressed thickness of the mortar will actually be.

[nelsonxn]

Quote: "A moderator can give it a more generic title if you'd like to suggest one."

CX, i like to take you up on your offer to change the title of this thread.

How about "Shower renovation questions at various points in project"

[cx]

Originally Posted by Nelson

Quote: "A moderator can give it a more generic title if you'd like to suggest one."

If you'll visit our FAQ or the Liberry you'll find a very brief tutorial on how best to post and properly attribute quotes here on the forums. Very simple once you see it.

Since you're apparently planning an exposed grout line at your corners, anyway, Nelson, this is the recommended way to do such corners, which includes a grout joint as well:



My opinion; worth price charged.

[nelsonxn]

thanks CX.

I'm about to lay down tile in three areas... the shower floor first, then the his and her side bathroom floors, and finally the shower walls - in that order.

My question is...

Should i grout immediately after each tiled area's mortar is set/dry (24 to 48 hrs) or can i wait till after all three of the tile areas are set/dry before grouting?