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Old 05-21-2018, 06:38 AM   #16
MolecularMan
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The "glue" that they put down the first time was white. It took maybe a minute to remove the whole thing.

I think this time they specifically used thin-set. But after reading more about mastic, it makes me worried they slapped that on the walls of the shower as well Looking at lowes (where they seemed to get all of their stuff) I wonder if they went with the MAPEI Premium Mortar Tile Mastic, as it has awful reviews and several people experiencing the same thing. I'm sure they used that on the walls as well as the tile is bigger and I'd hope they wouldn't use the other stuff rated for 12x12 tile.


Now it seems they never really packed the bigger joints with grout as my finger pushed it in, in several places.

So I told me wife we aren't using that shower for a while. Luckily we have showers downstairs as well (just the standard tub/shower stalls). I'm really tempted to just rip it up myself. I mean really the entire thing should be ripped up, but I just want it function and to not worry about selling someone else a problem on down the line.


I'm in greater Joplin, MO area (not exact..but you know the internet being what it is, lol)


Kman, I see you are in NW Arkansas. We lived in Fayetteville for a year. I've always wanted to give that place another shot. We really didn't like it when we lived there, but I think it is a lot of separate things that made it so. In our current life, we'd probably really like it.
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Last edited by MolecularMan; 05-21-2018 at 08:01 AM.
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Old 05-23-2018, 09:15 PM   #17
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Here is an update:

I decided to pull up a few tiles myself as I had planned to just redo the floor myself. This looks like a way bigger issue....

https://youtu.be/S8R0VDKPeFg
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Old 05-23-2018, 09:29 PM   #18
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Mastic! Mastic everywhere!
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Old 05-23-2018, 09:35 PM   #19
MolecularMan
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In the corner where I stuck my finger in.. there is nothing stopping it. I don't know if they cut the wall short or whatever was there already rotted out.

Where that wall tile is, the backside is wall to the closet. It's all just empty space that I can stick my finger it back there.


I need to find some sort of tile person or builder to come out and I need to find a lawyer I think.
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Old 05-24-2018, 02:21 PM   #20
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Sorry to keep posting, but does anyone know of a good tile setter in the SW MO area, specifically around the Joplin area?

I looked up certified tile installers, but the closest one is in Springfield (about an hour away). I really need to get someone out and get a pro's advice about what to do and how much it will cost to fix.
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Old 05-24-2018, 07:35 PM   #21
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what to do would be to tear it all out and start over. Anything that is done short of that would be a temporary fix to get the builder past his required 1 year warranty. I am 3 hours from you and if I wasn't completely behind schedule I would swing out and take a look. I watched your videos and there is no way you should be able to put a dent in the grout with your finger. I use flexcolor cq and while it is semi flexible it is not that flexible when it is cured. Best course of action would be to have the builder explain to you in writing how and what materials were used to construct your shower. my guess is that it was not constructed in a manner that would be to industry standards. As for having your shower replaced it is best to do a little homework (on here not youtube or any other site really the more I read on the internet the more I understand how there are so many people doing it wrong) on how a industry compliant shower is built. There are different ways but in the end your shower should 100% waterproof before the first tile is stuck( with thinset not mastic) Sorry I can't help you more or refer you someone I just don't know anyone that far south
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Old 05-25-2018, 06:51 AM   #22
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I really appreciate the reply.


Last night I did some further demo and popped a big wall tile. Using only the small flat head screw driver, I removed the whole piece with no breakage.


On the left side of the tile (looking at the wall), whatever they used was trowel'd vertically and dry, on the right side, the marks were perpendicular and circular and they just slapped on a big glob of stuff.. It was all completely wet.

I have also noticed they have some sort of exposed wood frame around the concrete pan. When the first guy was out to "redo" it he mentioned that as I asked and said something like "Oh that's just to make our form, that doesn't matter at all and could just rot away, no problem."

But.. exposed wood - I'd think eventually that would create mold and just all sorts of bad stuff. Yeah?
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Old 05-25-2018, 07:41 AM   #23
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So if indeed it was a form to screed off of then it should have been removed and filled with deck mud as soon as the screeding was done. Not only will it lead to mold but it will swell when it gets wet so how would the tile hold in place if what it was sitting on and further more what if it did rot away, what would the tile be sitting on then, you guessed it nothing. I know you are eager to see what is going on under there but I would slow down on tearing things out, it is possible that they will say you damaged something and that is why it failed. Though we all know this is not the case but don't give them any ammunition to say it was something you did. I would have a sit down with the builder and go over how the shower was constructed. It sounds like the builder himself doesn't know how to construct a shower and is relying on his tile setter to know his trade and unfortunately for his clients, he does not. With out knowing how the shower was constructed and what materials were used we can't give you specific rebuttals to have ready to come back at him with. I can say all day long based on what you are describing that your shower was constructed incorrectly but without specific details then it is just guess work. Well it could have been this is or that. I know this is frustrating you put your faith in the builder to do things right and that clearly didn't happen. There are hundreds of not thousands of tile guys out there building leaky shower because they just don't know what they are doing. As bad as it is to say at least they did such a bad job at it that it showed its ass right away,most of them don't show signs till well after the warranty has expired then you are up shit creek without a paddle
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Old 05-25-2018, 09:51 AM   #24
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John,

As tempting as it might be to continue probing I'd not touch it anymore at this point. You have enough evidence.

Get the builder out there and have a rational, business conversation about what you've found and learned. Take detailed photos, both close up and farther back for perspective. And as you are attempting to do, engage at least one tile installer for an assessment, two if you can find 'em. Even if you need to compensate them for their time.

Bare wood, lippage, mastic. None of that is proper for a shower. The home is still under warranty. I imagine consumer protection services in your location would be interested, as would the BBB. Maybe a local news outlet. An attorney certainly would be. Since he's build other homes you can bet your shower isn't the only one in trouble.

Work like that from a "builder" is unforgivable, and their response to it is even worse. I'd use every single resource I have to go after him.
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Old 05-25-2018, 10:51 AM   #25
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I really appreciate the replies.


After I pulled the one wall tile last night, I'm not going to touch the shower any further. It was plenty to show the tile doesn't have 95% coverage, half of what the slapped on was still wet..etc. I contacted the builder this morning and it blew up into an immediate argument. He said I'm just digging, trying to find things and I'm unable to be pleased.

I told him, if you used the right stuff from the start, I never would have questioned anything. And further, if I'm digging - you shouldn't be worried because I shouldn't find anything.

He came out later and talked to my wife as I was too angry to talk with him. He wants to say if they pull up more wall tile and see that it is "set" that we should reimburse him for the cost.

I reached out to a few certified tile installers in the Springfield area to see if they can help or if they know someone in the Joplin area that can come out.

Here is a final video from when I popped the wall tile last night.. no more touching the shower since you all mentioned it


https://youtu.be/SzxVDtNyX64
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Old 05-25-2018, 02:11 PM   #26
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holy smokes batman
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Old 05-25-2018, 03:11 PM   #27
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Your builder is a big jerk. I would pursue EVERY avenue until I had a nice shower that should last a lifetime.I do not to much like lawyers but in your case I would try to get a couple free consultations or pay for them if you must.I would talk to my neighbors to see if they had the same builder.And your lawyer will probably want to talk to them also. Go get the A.H.
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Old 05-25-2018, 04:17 PM   #28
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Some mastics can be used on a shower wall, but I would never use them under a larger tile, and never over a waterproof membrane. It'll take forever to dry.

Actually, I'd never use them in a shower anyway. Now you know why.
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Old 05-25-2018, 04:23 PM   #29
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Ouch...how do these guys sleep at night?
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Old 05-25-2018, 04:39 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justin
Ouch...how do these guys sleep at night?
drugs and alcohol
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