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Unread 01-11-2021, 08:09 PM   #1
Jake12
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Tub to shower conversion

I’m back. Training my next generation. Son is planning a bath remodel which includes a tub removal and conversion to a shower.
I’m trying to catch up on the latest product recommendations from the experts.
I built a kerdi shower 12 yrs ago which went really well. I laid a mud floor.
I’ve spent a few hours on the forums trying to catch up on latest technology which has created a few questions. I also purchased John’s latest books.

I’ve run across some debates between Kerdi products and others. So thought it was time to reconnect with the trusted experts.

I thought the trays seemed like a great concept but my project 12 yrs ago had an odd sized shower so i went with mud.

Seeing my sons house,with a standard tub tear out, I thought perfect spot for the tray... after my research here, starting to question that. My son is leaning that way too in interest of saving time and insuring a reliable base to build the shower and drain from. I want to help get him off on the best path.

1. What is issue I see hinted towards about the slope on the Kerdi trays?

2. His tub is 60 x 30 and looks like the tray is 38” so assuming we cut 4” off both sides? Any issues here?

3. Any other thoughts on trays? Other manufacturers?

3. See the Kerdi board and John is talking about that in his book. Is that still a good option? See shimming can be a challenge? Any other thoughts advice?

They are eager to go but need some homework before getting too far down the road.

Look forward to your recommendations
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Unread 01-11-2021, 08:45 PM   #2
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Welcome back, Scott.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott
I’m trying to catch up on the latest product recommendations from the experts.
That would be a bunch of folks not known to you who you've found on an Internet site? Just making sure we're on the same page here.

1. The Schluter foam shower trays I've seen have less than the required 1/4" per foot slope from the farthest corner to the drain. And the slope they do provide depends upon the subfloor being very near perfectly flat and level.

2. The issue there is that you end up with a perimeter that is not level, which can effect the appearance of your wall tile.

3. One manufacturer who I know claims all of their foam trays are properly sloped is the Noble Company. There could be others. But it's still a foam tray and may or may not fit your shower footprint and drain location and is still subject to all the other problems with foam shower trays.

Other thoughts are the need for a leveled subfloor, the need to cut the trays to fit the shower footprint, the need to cut it further to accommodate the drain location, the fragility of the foam resulting in big dimples if you kneel on them, and the high cost.

I would always recommend, and I would always do, a mortar bed floor for my shower of any style. The materials are dirt cheap, it matters not that your floor is not perfectly flat or level, it's not difficult to place the material, the floor can always have the required slope from a perfectly level perimeter and it always fits the footprint and drain location perfectly and it provides a much more solid floor for your shower. What's not to like?

3 (second time). The foam board is easy to carry and to cut, fairly easy to install, some say it's a lot faster to install, but with having to patch each fastener hole and all joints and seams, I'm not sure. But I haven't tried making a shower with it. It's also very expensive compared to the alternatives, 'specially hanging drywall and covering with Kerdi membrane.

For the professional for whom the cost is not an issue (customer pays for everything), it might be a good alternative. And some of our DIY visitors have opined that they favor it for the ease of handling and don't mind the extra cost.
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Unread 01-12-2021, 08:44 AM   #3
Jake12
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Thanks CX

Great points that will help us evaluate.

Yes to your first point.

I’m sure we’ll be back soon with questions once the work begins.

Great to see the JB site is still going strong.

Scott
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Unread 02-03-2021, 01:59 PM   #4
Jake12
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Thin set & trowel

We’re moving along
Got the Kerdi on the walls. We decided to go with your recommendation and will do a mud floor
I’m thinking we’ll tile the walls first using ledger board approach and then put in the floor
In prepping for the tile. Installing 3 x 12 subway.

What thinset do you recommend (is Versabond a good choice)?
What size trowel ?

Tiles have a rough edge but they want to keep grout line to a minimum. Is 1/16 going to be challenge?

Tavy spacers a good choice these days?

Thanks
Scott
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Unread 02-03-2021, 03:49 PM   #5
Lazarus
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You might want to get in touch with Paul Luccia in Houston. Unreal tile technician and he now has foam pans built to order. www.builtwithfoam.com
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Unread 02-03-2021, 10:25 PM   #6
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Says he's making a mud floor, Laz, why would he want to contact Paul?

Versabond would be a good choice. See my warranty information below.

I'd start with a 1/4" square notched trowel and adjust from there.

A 1/16th" grout joint is always a challenge, 'specially with tiles with a "rough edge." I'd recommend some plastic wedge-type spacers for your application.

My opinion; worth price charged.
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Unread 02-04-2021, 12:54 AM   #7
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He made several mentions of a foam tray option, CX.
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Unread 02-04-2021, 08:40 AM   #8
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Thanks CX sounds good.
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Unread 02-07-2021, 08:51 PM   #9
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Can you recommend some “wedge type” spacers?

Searching on line see various types with varying reviews. Many seem to be self leveling. I can see how a simple wedge would help on spots where trying to get the correct line or are you recommending a leveling type?
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Unread 02-07-2021, 09:21 PM   #10
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None of those "devices" or "systems" do any leveling, Scott, they're for lippage control, and no, that's not what I meant. I mean plain ol' smooth plastic wedges, which may come in various sizes, but you want the ones that taper to near zero.

Several companies who once made the wedges I'm suggesting no longer make any such, but I think Rubi still does and possibly QEP. May well be others, too, but I haven't had to look for any for years on accounta I still have buckets of Tile Spikes, which I wish you had access to, but they are also long out of that business.
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Unread 02-08-2021, 11:00 AM   #11
Jake12
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Ok thanks CX. That was the route I was trying to follow and was ending up at a lot of dead ends. Your clarification confirms what I was thinking.

Changed up the order on the project and went ahead with floor. Mud seems to have turned out well. Ready for Kerdi. Wasted about an hour debating over those spacers they supply with the drain. Finally found a good thread in here that reconfirmed my thinking. I ended up making my own out of a couple of scraps.

Got the drain pipe moved and connected too. Told my son to show his wife she has a new functioning drain they can pour water down... progress...

Anyway get the Kerdi (pan & curb) finished during the week and maybe tile on the weekend

Thanks again.
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Unread 03-01-2021, 10:29 AM   #12
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We finished the wall tile and installed the Kerdi over the mud floor. I was concerned as there were some loose sand size pieces that came off as we stood on it to work the walls.
Structurally it looks great so we swept it up vacuumed and installed the Kerdi sheet with the thin set. We do have a few spots where a sand piece is noticeable or we can feel it under Kerdi. In one spot I’m concerned we may have worked one through the membrane. But also concerned about the other spots if they need to be addressed before proceeding?
What are our options?
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Unread 03-01-2021, 09:36 PM   #13
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Would kerdi fix suffice? Or do we need to patch with kerdi?
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Unread 03-01-2021, 10:51 PM   #14
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First, who is Tom, please?

Second, are we patching the floor now or the ledger fastener holes?
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Unread 03-02-2021, 06:45 AM   #15
Jake12
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Tom is my son and It’s his shower we’re working together on. So CX meet Tom & Tom meet CX. it’s time he gets to know the team.

It’s the floor we are concerned about.
We used the Kerdi fix on the ledger holes.

Sorry for confusion.
Thanks
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