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Unread 02-19-2012, 01:59 PM   #451
Emil Volk
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John: the photo is of exactly the same corner (taken one minute part). The perspective of the first photo may make it look different. The second photo FROM INSIDE give a clearer picture (no return jam...I think it is called). I am not using caulk or adhesive to fix the liner only 1" nails. I fold over the liner at the corners and nails it. The previous photos cited give an excellent view of the lineR work.

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Unread 02-19-2012, 02:03 PM   #452
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But Emil, you do have little "wall" or something on the outside of the shower, no?

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Unread 02-19-2012, 02:07 PM   #453
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John: the wooden studs are furred out by 1/4" so the cement board is moved out 1/4" to accommodate the liner at the bottom. This is the strategy to make it tileable.


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Unread 02-19-2012, 02:15 PM   #454
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Ceci: look at second photo. To the right as one moves from the shower to the curb then on the right there is the wooden corner stud. To the right after 5" of dry wall there is drywall corner.

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Unread 02-19-2012, 02:18 PM   #455
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Ceci: please look at post #338 ( see link below)

http://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin/...=93539&page=23


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Unread 02-19-2012, 02:28 PM   #456
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Yes, that is a good photo. Anyway, John wasn't talking about the part I thought he was talking about. I was mixed up. We'll wait for John.

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Unread 02-19-2012, 02:37 PM   #457
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Hi Emil

I think you need to get it similar to #328. I would make a cut at the 45 degree crease and unfold the liner at the back wall. You'll also need a small rectangle to wrap from the top of the curb up the wall (like Henry did in his photo). The flap in the shower can be glued to the wall material. Yes the cutting can be tricky, but you already have a much better idea of what you're up against, and what your objectives are.

Right now keep practicing with what will work best for you.
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Unread 02-19-2012, 03:26 PM   #458
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Hi Emil,

I had a sudden inspiration to open this thread. I looked over the last few pages to catch up, but forgive me if I cover things that have already been discussed.

Pre-slope
The photos of the pre-slope concern me, but I believe you've already been made aware of this. Typically, I will use the bottom 2x4 as a guide. I would guess that you are shooting for 3/4" of slope (from the edge to the drain)? If so, factoring in the bottom flange of the drain is 1/4" you will want to be at about one inch high around the perimeter, in other words, you will see the top 1/2" of the bottom 2x4 all the way around. I hope I've explained this well.

Liner
If I were hired on to install the liner in your shower, I would not cut the folds going over the curb. The only punctures that I would have in the shower area would be 1) the drain hole 2) the four bolt holes. All other punctures would be A)the top of the liner, at least 6" above curb and B) the front of the curb outside the wet area-not the inside or top of the curb.

Thanks to Ceci, I took photos of a liner I did so people could see how I fold them. The pictures make it much easier to understand. The liners that I buy are black 30mil liners from Pasco. It looks like you have a 40mil, so it will be a little more difficult to fold.
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Unread 02-19-2012, 03:31 PM   #459
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Here's some more photos. The second one explains where the different cuts/folds are. The last one shows what it looks like when you get the cbu attached and the lath over the curb.
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Unread 02-19-2012, 03:33 PM   #460
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It seems that John favors the original approach as given by BOB. In other words he does not mind cutting the liner inside carefully, but advocates adding another piece of liner (rectangular) stuck on top of curb liner and up the wall.

That the liner is not cut on top of the curb (like Harry Dunbar) does not bother him.

I wanted to avoid cutting the liner (like Jim suggested), but the bunching is problem for fitting the board and metal lather on top of the curb.

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Unread 02-19-2012, 03:41 PM   #461
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Yes, Emil, but one could get a Pasco liner so less bulk and no inside cut. It's your shower so you must decide which way to go. Now, go decide.

Hey Jim, I remember you from longggggggg ago. Long time no see. How the heck are you? Very nice pics. of an alternative way to go. I, a very grateful visitor, think they should be in the library. Just saying.

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Unread 02-19-2012, 03:47 PM   #462
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Hi Jim

Thank you for sharing your photo's and techniques!

I wish I had some of my liner pictures to share. With the proper folding and cutting / overlapping techniques there is no bunching.

I do not favor piercing the liner on the curb at all. I like to fold the wire totally over the entire curb. The liner can be secured to the substrate of the curb with Noblebond 150 caulk.

I also don't favor dropping the CBU into the pan. If stone is used (with no surface waterproofing), wicking can still occur and darken the first course on the wall. I know, because I tear them out all the time. No leaks, but wicking moisture into CBU and stone.
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Unread 02-19-2012, 03:57 PM   #463
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Hi Ceci

If Emil wants to avoid "bulk", he could go to a surface waterproofing system.

Noble's CPE Chloraloy is the best pan liner on the market. Yes, there is the same bulk with any other 40 mil system. PVC is more difficult to work with, and doesn't have the track record as Noble's CPE. Yep, I've torn out plenty of failed PVC lined pans as well. I have seen them get brittle and crack over time.

Many products on the market are identical, only private labeled. Have to really do your homework to see who makes what for who.

Please share why you suggest Pasco.

Never said this was going to be easy. (That's why Pro's still exist!)
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Unread 02-19-2012, 04:02 PM   #464
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John
Please share why you suggest Pasco.


I assume you talking to Jim since I don't know anything, don't favor anything. Jim mentioned he uses Pasco, that's all.

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Unread 02-19-2012, 04:06 PM   #465
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Thanks Jim:

From Bobs "rule of thumb" I calculated the height of the prepan mud as follows:

the maximum length from corner to shower drain is ~30 "(2 ½ feet) so if we go with 3/8" per foot slope that is 5/2*3/8" = 15/16 " for height of mud prepan above the level of the lower flange (1 1/4") of the shower drain above plywood. Total height mud above plywood is thus 15/16 + 1 4/16= 2 3/16 "


Originally I was advised (not by anyone in this group) to use a chalk line to achieve the same level all the way around the perimeter. This was a disaster, since while I was putting mud in place the chalk marks were wiped away. The outer perimeter was not the same all the way around. I have been working on this to make it the same all the way around the perimeter.

Is that what you are concerned about when you reviewed my prepan?

You are correct the Oatey liner is 40 mil (0.04" thick) so it is 1/3 thicker than yours so it will be more difficult to work with. For the shower drain I have (from the Tile Shop) they recommend a 40 ml thick membrane to go with the drain. So I am not sure you can use a 30 ml thick membrane.




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