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Unread 03-21-2021, 09:32 AM   #1
JdMatlack
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extensive lippage on subway tile

Can anyone justify lippage that looks like this in new construction on sheet rock?
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Unread 03-21-2021, 09:49 AM   #2
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Yes, 3-D Finish. Standard practice for hacks & bullshitters lol
Lotsa beer or substance ina veins of that guy, or the GC screwed him & he gave him a farewell gift
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Unread 03-21-2021, 09:50 AM   #3
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Welcome, John.

Short answer: Probably not.

Several issues in play here, one of which is the wall lighting, which exacerbates the lippage even if it falls within the tile industry standards. I'm not sure that's a major factor here, but turn them off and let's look again.

Lippage, as defined in the tile industry standards, is the "differences in elevation between edges of adjacent tile modules" and is influenced by a number of listed factors, including the allowable of thickness variation of the tiles, the allowable warpage of the tiles, the spacing of the tiles, the angle of natural or manufacturered light, and the highly reflective surfaces of the tiles."

At this juncture we know nothing at all about your installation other than the lighting. Fill in the blanks for us.

My opinion; worth price charged.
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Unread 03-21-2021, 10:23 AM   #4
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Will be going out again today for picture with light off, I have seen it with the light off and it is still noticeable, just not as blatant.. However for the next 30 plus years, the light will be on during every evening meal preparation, and I don't look forward to every guest asking, "what's wrong with your tile". I think it was just slapped up in gotta get this done and get a drink mode of operations. I did hardwoods, vinyl, and carpet for thirty years. No professional tile work except in my own house and a couple relatives doing multiple backsplash without anything like this. Meeting with the Builder Tuesday for walk through. I just want to be confident that this is over the top. I have done the credit card slide, and it stops fully on at least 8 of the installed tiles just in the cooktop area.
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Unread 03-21-2021, 10:32 AM   #5
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Do you have access to any spares of the tile that was installed, John? If so, grab a couple, lay them face to face, see how much they "rock" on each other.

If they are significantly bowed there will be more lippage.

And yeah, those lights being installed at the far rear of the hood are exacerbating the issue (not to mention not lighting the cook top very well). As an aside, if you're installing under cabinet lighting those, too, should be installed to the front of the cabinet.
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Unread 03-21-2021, 03:21 PM   #6
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I have no doubt there were bowed tiles in the inventory, I dealt with some in my few ceramic jobs, but it just lazy to me not to cull the really bowed pieces where you know there will be light.
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Unread 03-22-2021, 01:19 AM   #7
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I'd be on the horn with the builder immediately. The squeaky wheel always gets oiled.
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Unread 03-22-2021, 06:39 AM   #8
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That’s for sure Al, ‘specially this one is clearly jacked up. I reckon the sub will get this squared away if he’s got any sense of mind to keep working with the builder or as a contractor. Hopefully it was an anomaly of lapse in judgement on their parts. I cant see how anybody could screw up 3 by 6 to that degree.
I wouldn’t accept anything short of a rip out & redo with the same or upgraded Finish material, IMO.
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Unread 03-22-2021, 06:43 PM   #9
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I saw a recent estimate which stated that all under-cabinet lighting must be installed before the tile goes up.

Not a bad idea, I think.
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Unread 03-22-2021, 07:15 PM   #10
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I always ask if there is going to be under cabinet lighting because I did a low fired glass backsplash that flexcolor cq scratched the tile but didn't know it until the customer added their lights

I wish I had found this thread before I did that job

https://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin...ad.php?t=79760
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Unread 03-22-2021, 07:59 PM   #11
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Shawn, as has come up on these forums many times, and in Dave's article that you linked, this sort of issue is kind of thing best handled in advance through clear communication with the end user.

I can't tell you if the tile installation in this OP's home does or does not meet the tile industry standards aside from the lighting aspect. If it does, or if the tiles don't meet ANSI A137.1 standards, it's gonna boil down to a "discussion" after the fact, which is always fraught with frustration on at least one, and frequently both sides.

How was the installation advertised to the customer? Who chose the tile? Who chose the lighting? Did the installer know about the lighting? Gonna be lots of discussion and apparently some finger pointing. Will the fingers get pointed in the right direction(s)? Stay tuned.

I'll be very curious to see how this is resolved and I hope John will keep us informed.

My opinion; worth price charged.
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