Failed Flood Test

[nikie103]

Hello! While I have been reading posts and Liberry information over the past several months, this is my first time posting. To give a brief background, we hired a professional contractor to turn a bedroom into a bathroom. This project began on June 2, 2021 and is ongoing. We are on the 3rd attempt at the shower floor (1st time there was puddling, 2nd time no pre-slope). On this most recent attempt, our contractor sub-contracted another company to complete the shower pan. Noble Pro-Slope was used for the preslope, followed by a Chloraloy liner. Flood test was done today and it leaked substantially around the drain. Below the shower floor is our garage with open ceiling so it was easy to see the dripping water right away and the flood test was stopped. We notified the contractor and they came a few hours later to remedy the leak. Attached is a photo of what they did to "fix" the issue. Another flood test is scheduled for Monday. Is this a proper solution to fix the leak? If not, what steps should have been taken? The contractor assured us that he left the weep holes open. Thank you in advance for any information or advice you provide.

[Tile & Stone Guild]

That’s a hot mess. Find a new tile guy, have the contractor replace the drain assembly completely and start new. Their solution to the leak is a prelude of what’s to come.

[Carbidetooth]

I don't know the Noble system. What sort of drain and attachment do they recommend?

Agee on the hot mess. Is that silicone caulk?

I may have answered my own question. Looks like Noble has a flashing that transitions between clamping drain and Pro-Slope. Similar to what's called divot method. I don't see any evidence of that.

If you want proof of their methodology, ask to see manufacturer's instructions describing the method they've employed. As the one writing the checks, you have every right to know what's being used. My guess is the invention of a hack.

[cx]

Welcome, Nikie.

I hafta agree with Jeff's assessment.

Peter, I think that a Noble foam pre-slope and Chloraloy liner are used with a typical clamping ring drain. Just proprietary materials for a traditionally built shower receptor.

[nikie103]

Yes, CX is correct, it’s a typical clamping drain that is used with these materials. The substance around the drain is NobleSealant 150, which is what is recommended to be used to seam Chloraloy, seal between liner & clamping drain and bond preformed corners to liner. Contractor just took it a few steps further and slathered it around the drain after the failed flood test. Suggestions on where to go from here? Tear out liner & start over I assume.

[jadnashua]

Another flood test? What do they say about thinset bonding to their sealant, and how thick it can be? The sealant is somewhat flexible, and movement can be a problem for tile adhesion. I think that there must be some practical limit on how thick it can be, but do not know.

[e3]

Noblesealant 150 is Blue in color..is that?
Weep holes are plugged.
No reason for the sealant as applied, if done correct.
Is the membrane even clamped under the collar?



Things don't look good ....! I would not accept it.

[nikie103]

Hi Jim,
I'm not sure about thinset bonding to the sealant or where the thinset would come into contact with it. There will be a mud bed over top of the liner, then thinset/tile. Nonetheless, it seems my suspicions have been confirmed, via feedback on this thread, that this it not an approved nor acceptable solution to the problem.

Hi Eric,
Thanks for the feedback. Yes, it is blue. The photo makes it appear much lighter/whiter than it actually is.

[e3]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FanTIrkPKA

[nikie103]

Thank you, Eric. I had probably watched this video 30 times prior to reaching out for advice on here. I can verify that this is the installation method they used as I witnessed the install. However, for some reason during the flood test it leaked around the drain. I'm not sure if a faulty drain could have been to blame, inadequate seal between liner and drain or something else. After the failed flood test, we notified the contractor and he said he would come over to take a look. I never imagined slathering NobleSealant 150 around the drain would be his solution. It obviously didn't sit well with me, but this is certainly not my area of expertise so I came here for feedback before jumping to conclusions.

This bathroom project has been a very stressful and unfortunate series of events, which we have been dealing with for over 6 months now. After questioning some of the quality of work being done, I began researching shower pan construction. Over the past several months I have read, researched and watch videos until my eyes have bled. The frustrating part is that it has been pretty much impossible to find a qualified contractor in my area -most I've spoken to have never even heard of a pre-slope. I'm sure you can imagine my dismay. I got nowhere with our area plumbing inspector on some of the issues we were having, and had to go to his supervisor (our state plumping inspector) just to get a flood test. When I asked the state plumbing inspector about a pre-slope he said it's not necessary. It has been quite an interesting and eye opening process for sure.

[John Bridge]

Hi Nikie,

I did many many conventional showers before I began doing Schluter showers. I know that in the method you're describing the liner is supposed to be sealed against the bottom flange as it is installed. It sounds like that wasn't done.

I've had more than one plumbing inspector tell me that a pre-slope is not needed. According to both major plumbing codes it is.

[Dave Gobis]

What John and Eric said. It is most unfortunate we are surrounded by alleged untrained "professionals" who can't or won't read instructions because they think they know everything. Sadly it has become a commonplace.

[nikie103]

Question for Eric
I am in the process of ordering all new materials (Chloraloy liner, preformed corners, drain just to be safe & sealant); however, Noble is out of stock of the 150 sealant. I read that the NobleWeld 100 can also be used with Chloraloy, but could the NobleSealant 250 be used in place of NobleSealant 150? If so, what is the difference between 250 & 150 other than the 250 being low VOC?

Thank you in advance!

[nikie103]

Also, (just for reference) here is a photo taken after the failed flood test, but before the excessive application of NobleSealant 150 around the drain.

[e3]

Over all the install photo looks good.(I am a bit surprised)
Nobleweld 100 works great for seaming /bonding corners.(higher VOC much like PVC pipe solvent)(but its not pvc cement)
For bonding the Chloraloy to drain body 250 is fine...