Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile

Welcome to John Bridge / Tile Your World, the friendliest DIY Forum on the Internet


Advertiser Directory
JohnBridge.com Home
Buy John Bridge's Books

Go Back   Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile > Tile & Stone Forums > Tile Forum/Advice Board

Sponsors


Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Unread 03-24-2007, 04:16 PM   #1
tga
Registered User
 
tga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Central New York
Posts: 4
Question How? Attach cement board to cement surface

Hi, I am a glass artisan.
I am getting ready to attach mosaic panels I created on cement board to a garage made of cement. I would estimate that the mosaiced panels weigh less than 50 lbs. each. I want to be sure that the panel(s) will stay up for many years and that strong winds will not effect them.

The panels are mosaiced using glass tiles so if I would like to attach whatever I need to to the cement board before mosaic/grouting so that it wouldn't interfere with the design.

I am in Central NY and the temps get to minus zero with wind chill factor. The tiles are frost proof - am I correct to use cement board? and what is the best way to attach the panels.

I appreciate any advice. Thanks. Shelley
tga is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Unread 03-24-2007, 06:22 PM   #2
Keeney
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 127
If you want it to be permanent, you could stick it on there with some thin-set (or maybe some mason's mortar). Mix it up, trowel it on the wall with a fairly large notched trowel, and press the cement board firmly into it with perhaps some twisitng / sliding or gentle thumping to make good contact with the thinset. Brace the cement board in place for a day while it sets so it doesn't slide down or pull off. A few weeks later when it cures to full hardness, it won't be coming off without some serious work with a hammer and chissel.

If you want it to be removable, you should drill some screw anchor holes into the concrete wall and use screws therough the cement board from the front. A few screws in the corners, or perhaps around the eges might not look so bad.

- Rick
Keeney is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-24-2007, 07:27 PM   #3
MudMaker
The Revolution has begun/Make America Great Again
 
MudMaker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Centerville, Ohio
Posts: 8,313
Shelley,
Welcome to the Forum....


If the walls are straight, why not attach the glass tiles directly to the walls?
__________________
mm (aka "Paco")
MudMaker is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-24-2007, 10:02 PM   #4
cx
Moderator emeritus
 
cx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Boerne, Texas
Posts: 95,687
Welcome, Shelley.

Shouldn't be difficult to firmly attach your CBU pieces to the wall and make them stay. But I think your problems will lie in the freeze/thaw aspect since you'll apparently not have any sort of waterproofing behind the glass.

But first things first. If you've already set the glass on the CBU, do tell what CBU you've used. Some are rated for exterior applications, some not.

My opinion; worth price charged.
__________________
CX

Y'ALL NEW VISITORS READ THIS HERE!
cx is online now   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-26-2007, 01:06 PM   #5
tga
Registered User
 
tga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Central New York
Posts: 4
Smile Thanks for the advice .... more ....

I have not purchased all the cement board but the demo is done on Durock. What brand do you suggest?
I am not sure if I will be able to install the tiles directly on the garage myself because it is a Municipal parking garage, the City might be installing my finished panels. But I want to have input. (Also I am a little afraid of heights and it is a 3-story garage!)

I prefer not to use the screws as I will compromise the panels by leaving spots ungrouted, thereby allowing water to collect in the spots I have left open for the screws. (But I will if I have to). Someone told me to use "z" or "l" brackets? What is your opinion on those? Then we would anchor the screws into the cement garage to hold the brackets, right?
I am just concerned that one good wind storm and the panels will come down on someone's head (from 30-50 feet above - not a pretty thought! - and an even worst thought is I might be liable!)

I will find out for sure at our next meeting whether I will be responsible for installation or they will do it themselves. If I am responsible, I will need to contract the job out - anyone in the Central NY area? or can you recommend someone?
Thanks!
tga is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-26-2007, 02:24 PM   #6
cx
Moderator emeritus
 
cx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Boerne, Texas
Posts: 95,687
Give us a better idea how large this will be. How many of these sheets of CBU will be going up there together?

Durock brand is indicated for exterior applications. Problem I see with it is the raw edges that you won't be able to treat in any way after installation. Not only from a moisture entry standpoint, but from the aesthetic point of having fairly ragged joints between sections of your artwork.

The Durock advertises to be freeze/thaw stable per industry standards, but I honestly don't know how that computes so far as protecting a glass tile installation. I think I'd worry.

Again, attaching the panels to the wall would not be my main concern. It will be relatively easy to just leave our a few of your glass pieces where the fasteners will be placed, then install and grout the remaining pieces. But what about the seams?

You could also install the panels quite easily with an adhesive such as that made by the Laticrete company for installing large stone pieces in almost exactly the situation you present. I suggest you call Laticrete (800-243-4788) and ask them about using Latipoxy 310 . That would eliminate the fastener problem, but not the raw edge problem.

But I would also suggest you consider installing your mosaic on something other than CBU. If you created them on a heavy sheet membrane such as NobleSeal. That way the seams could be made to fit the pattern of the artwork, the sections attached to the wall with thinset or other proprietary pookey, which would reduce the freeze/thaw exposure, and then it could all be grouted in place for a seamless installation.

Now let's wait for others to come by and 'splain why none of that will work.

My opinion; worth price charged.
__________________
CX

Y'ALL NEW VISITORS READ THIS HERE!
cx is online now   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-26-2007, 09:16 PM   #7
e3
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: mi.
Posts: 4,942
Send a message via Yahoo to e3
I'm with CX..Not sure where in NYC but we just did a big art project with some kids for a school .Each kid did some then they installed them .Cut the membrane in 12" x 12" ..tiles from around the world or something..
Bond tile with thin set then pannels with same.
__________________
Eric
Noble Company
e3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-29-2007, 03:44 PM   #8
tga
Registered User
 
tga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Central New York
Posts: 4
more details ...

There are 3 indents in each of the cement columns of the parking garage, one on each level. The rectanglular indents measure 14"x28" each. If I did the panels on the cement board I would get the edges as smooth as possible. Haven't got the depth of the indents that the panels would be set in. There is a possibility that the edges wouldn't be visible if they were set inside. I recently bought some liquid electric tape that I was going to experiment with, thinking it would seal the edges. Is that a crazy idea or would it work?

I really don't want to leave the grouting to anyone else, and I really can't see myself up there grouting....but then I guess that is what tile setters are for, right?
tga is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-29-2007, 04:08 PM   #9
cx
Moderator emeritus
 
cx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Boerne, Texas
Posts: 95,687
Oh, hell, I was envisioning several full sheets of CBU going together up there, Shelley.

For those little pieces, there would be no problem at all to set the whole thing with thinset or epoxy and no mechanical fasteners at all, except possibly for temporarily holding them while the pookey cured. With the epoxy, you wouldn't even need that, just pewt some big dollops on the back of each piece and moosh it against the wall. Use a very good quality caulking on the top and sides (but not the bottom) and go home, say I.

If you wanna waterproof the edges of the boards (good eye-dee), don't try to reinvent the wheel. There are a number of good liquid-applied waterproofing membranes made especially for the purpose, such as Laticrete 9235 or Custom's RedGard. In fact, if you elect to use the CBU, I would recommend you cover the whole thing with the waterproofing if the glass tile manufacturer will go for it.

My opinion; worth price charged.

And please go to the UserCP near the top of the page, find Edit Signature, and enter your first name so it will appear with each post and we won't hafta go searchin' for it, eh?
__________________
CX

Y'ALL NEW VISITORS READ THIS HERE!
cx is online now   Reply With Quote
Unread 03-30-2007, 12:29 PM   #10
tga
Registered User
 
tga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Central New York
Posts: 4
Thumbs up Thank you, thank you!!

Duh, never even considered the caulking!

Thanks so much for all your advice. I feel much better about it knowing that the advice came from the experts! I will post an update and let you know what method we end up using!

Thanks again...and if anyone needs a mosaic artist, let me know.
__________________
Shelley Turner, Glass Artisan
TURNER GLASS ART
Stained Glass, Mosaic, and Ceramics

www.turnerglassart.com
tga is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 09-18-2009, 06:03 PM   #11
john.hobart
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 1
Question attaching tile panels

Nice to join a forum of like souls with problems and solutions that match mine. I have been planning how to attach BISAZZA glass tiles to waterproof cement sheeting and have so far relied on the advice of a professional tiler to prepare the sheet to increase tile adhesion. Product names and formulation vary so much world wide so I omit the product name. My problem now is how to attach these panels to an external concrete wall, thankfully at eye level.I want to be able to finish each panel under cover, then attach one at a time ,[weight is a consideration] as simply as possible,outdoors. I also want to be able to remove the panels individually if there are problems, repair, then re-attach "easily". All I can think of is to have galvanized angle iron "frames" made, with cross bracing and attach these securely to the wall with bolts. This might give extra edge , and back support to each of the panels. The panels can be attached with screws that can be covered by tiles. Problem is , that I am the "artist" and not an engineer used to dealing with these matters. Maybe I am over-engineering the whole thing. Any suggestions are welcome.
__________________
john
john.hobart is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Stonetooling.com   Tile-Assn.com   National Gypsum Permabase


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:38 AM.


Sponsors

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2018 John Bridge & Associates, LLC