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Unread 12-06-2015, 09:39 AM   #196
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YES I would.

The guvmint makes all sorts of lists. Voting is a constitutional right yet we all register, get on a guvmint list then are required to show a guvmint issued ID (another list) to exercise that right even though voter fraud is a teensy fraction of 1% and I'm pretty sure no one died. My fair state sees fit to publish the information on the voting registration list.

Sure, there are errors on voting lists, terror watch lists, no fly lists, my grocery list, as we deal with people who write the lists and who make mistakes in both directions in favor and against those on the list. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't take prudent steps to reduce guns in the hands of terrorists.

And thank you for clearly answering the question.
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Unread 12-06-2015, 10:02 AM   #197
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Post #177

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Originally Posted by Donnie
Depriving a US citizen of a constitutional right without due process would be a violation of the fifth and fourteenth amendments.
I notice that this hasn't been addressed. How do you deprive someone of a constitutional right without even going through a court? Could it be taken away simply because someone somewhere thought they might need to be on a list?
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Unread 12-06-2015, 10:23 AM   #198
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck
What law could you pass that would stop terrorist/criminals from getting their hands on guns?

Chuck, given that there are an estimated 300M+ guns floating around this country I think we all know that it's impossible today to pass any law that would prevent in all cases an individual from obtaining a weapon with intent to harm others. So your question as framed is absurd and intended to provocate, and I think you know it. What Paul and others are asking is what laws could be passed to reduce the chances of weapons falling into the hands of those intending to harm others? So I'll answer that question since it is the right question. My list would include closing the gun show loophole, denying a sale to anyone on the FBI terrorist watch list, ban the sale of high capacity clips and magazines, ban the sale of military tactical gear to civilians, repeal the Dickey act banning federal funding of studies by the CDC and others on gun violence in America, further tighten background checks and extend waiting periods, outlaw ammunition designed to inflict massive carnage on human bodies.

So Chuck, what laws do think could be passed that would help to reduce gun violence in America?
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Unread 12-06-2015, 12:36 PM   #199
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Kevin,

We do that all the time.

Example; You have the constitutional right to free speech. But its against the law to incite a riot. Clearly inciting a riot isn't in the constitution. The 'right' to incite a riot was taken away by passing laws.

Does passing a law prohibiting me from saying what I want to incite a riot violate my constitutional rights?
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Unread 12-06-2015, 12:49 PM   #200
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What is the criteria for getting on an FBI terrorist watch list?

Kevin, the gun banners aren't concerned with trivial obstacles such as due process, or, constitutional rights. Nor are they interested in public safety. They just want to get teh guns. This is evidenced by the fact that the "solutions" they propose, will do little to nothing, to stop mass shootings, but will do much to punish law abiding gun owners.

I wish they would just be honest and admit they want to abolish the Second Amendment. Then we could proceed from there, instead of engaging in this ridiculous kabuki dance of theirs.
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Unread 12-06-2015, 01:24 PM   #201
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg
Kevin, the gun banners aren't concerned with trivial obstacles such as due process, or, constitutional rights. Nor are they interested in public safety. They just want to get teh guns. This is evidenced by the fact that the "solutions" they propose, will do little to nothing, to stop mass shootings, but will do much to punish law abiding gun owners.

I wish they would just be honest and admit they want to abolish the Second Amendment. Then we could proceed from there, instead of engaging in this ridiculous kabuki dance of theirs.
That's a fine example of narrow minded extremism, a hallmark of the terrorist mentality. Your tactic is to marginalize all moderate points of view into a polarizing black or white choice, ignoring all reason and eliminating all debate. You would be well off to understand that many of us gun owners are seeking ways to reduce the violence short of banning gun all guns. I hear nothing from the gun extremists that could be construed as constructive suggestions toward addressing what is a huge health issue is our society.
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Unread 12-06-2015, 02:51 PM   #202
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bodie
Chuck, given that there are an estimated 300M+ guns floating around this country I think we all know that it's impossible today to pass any law that would prevent in all cases an individual from obtaining a weapon with intent to harm others. So your question as framed is absurd and intended to provocate, and I think you know it. What Paul and others are asking is what laws could be passed to reduce the chances of weapons falling into the hands of those intending to harm others? So I'll answer that question since it is the right question. My list would include closing the gun show loophole, denying a sale to anyone on the FBI terrorist watch list, ban the sale of high capacity clips and magazines, ban the sale of military tactical gear to civilians, repeal the Dickey act banning federal funding of studies by the CDC and others on gun violence in America, further tighten background checks and extend waiting periods, outlaw ammunition designed to inflict massive carnage on human bodies.

So Chuck, what laws do think could be passed that would help to reduce gun violence in America?

It does NOT matter what law you pass, period!!!! People that don't give a crap about the law still will not care about the law no mater the knee jerk reaction or how good it makes you feel when you put your head on your pillow at night.

You get get all tangled up in the weeds all day long but when you open your eyes and stand back and look at the big big picture you will not even make a dent in what you are trying to achieve.

Terrorist/criminals are laughing at you on your naivety. The only thing a terrorist/criminals worry about is an armed populous.

The only folks that have a solid plan is Israel. We need to mimic their plan.

BTW where is all of the conservatives around here? Good grief.
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Unread 12-06-2015, 03:24 PM   #203
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We are busy being narrow minded extremists.
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Unread 12-06-2015, 04:26 PM   #204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mullet
It does NOT matter what law you pass, period!!!! People that don't give a crap about the law still will not care about the law no mater the knee jerk reaction or how good it makes you feel when you put your head on your pillow at night.
Shall we get rid of all criminal laws then? After all criminals are going to go ahead and do their criminal acts no matter what. So why not legalize all crime.

What do you think?
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Unread 12-06-2015, 05:03 PM   #205
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Why not enforce the already existing laws instead of passing more--

as for being one the no fly list--all sorts of folks who are not terrorist or criminal in any way find themselves on the list--support a group the SPLC considers radical can get you there. having a Ron Paul sticker on your car, being associated with the Oath Keepers or any other groups that don't conform to the PC correct agenda can also get you there. There are some 700,000 names on the list--that's a lot of potential terrorist, eh???

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Unread 12-06-2015, 05:08 PM   #206
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First we'd need to throw our hands in the air because there is nothing we can do !
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Unread 12-06-2015, 05:26 PM   #207
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John V
Why not enforce the already existing laws instead of passing more--

as for being one the no fly list--all sorts of folks who are not terrorist or criminal in any way find themselves on the list--support a group the SPLC considers radical can get you there. having a Ron Paul sticker on your car, being associated with the Oath Keepers or any other groups that don't conform to the PC correct agenda can also get you there. There are some 700,000 names on the list--that's a lot of potential terrorist, eh???

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul
First we'd need to throw our hands in the air because there is nothing we can do !
Nahhh, just get good training and a CCW permit and not be so dependent on the government for your security blanket.
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Unread 12-06-2015, 05:26 PM   #208
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I normally only lurk any more, because this particular portion of the site is a huge exercise in futility, although it is mildly entertaining. But this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by JVC
as for being one the no fly list--all sorts of folks who are not terrorist or criminal in any way find themselves on the list--support a group the SPLC considers radical can get you there. having a Ron Paul sticker on your car, being associated with the Oath Keepers or any other groups that don't conform to the PC correct agenda can also get you there.
Is bullshit. But keep on keepin' on...
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Unread 12-06-2015, 05:47 PM   #209
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I'd kinda like to know what criteria are used for putting someone on the list. Maybe someone can enlighten us, in the meantime I'm going to research Google it.
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Unread 12-06-2015, 05:59 PM   #210
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bodie
That's a fine example of narrow minded extremism, a hallmark of the terrorist mentality.
That is literally one of the most asinine comments I have ever read on any forum. And that's saying a lot. Congratulations.

Since when is a concern for due process of law, and the upholding of Constitutional rights considered "extremism"? Let alone a terrorist mentality. That is beyond the pale.

Quote:
Your tactic is to marginalize all moderate points of view into a polarizing black or white choice, ignoring all reason and eliminating all debate. You would be well off to understand that many of us gun owners are seeking ways to reduce the violence short of banning gun all guns. I hear nothing from the gun extremists that could be construed as constructive suggestions toward addressing what is a huge health issue is our society.
Unlike leftist gun grabbers, I am not employing any tactic. Liberty is the foundation of this once great nation. That you believe upholding the principles of liberty is somehow a devious "tactic", speaks volumes about your own anti-American position. A look at the bolded above, tells real Americans all we need to know. So as long as we can own a single shot break barrel .22, the Second Amendment is upheld, in the mind of anti-American leftists.

I suggest you start the movement to abolish the Second Amendment, because it is obvious to even the casual observer, that is what you and your ilk seek. Please start before the run-up to the 2016 election.
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