Do we need to tear up this shower Pan?

[modismom]

Hello! We bought this house 3 years ago and recently started demo’ing the basement bathroom. It has a very large shower. We removed the tile floor and walls/etc. My question is- do we have to remove and rebuild the shower pan? There’s a large gap between it and the walls. Any and all advice/help is greatly appreciated.

[speed51133]

well, you 100% need to change the drain. If there was a membrane under that floor, you have cut off the sides of it that would go up the wall. You COULD chip out the floor around the drain and replace it with a drain like a Kerdi drain allowing for a topical membrane and tie in the walls with that membrane. You could also add a membrane on top and then add in another mortar slope. Both would need a new drain. These all assume your current floor is properly sloped to the drain. But I do not think anyone here will advocate for these.

Unfortunately, everyone will tell you yes.

[modismom]

Mike,
Thanks for your reply. I have no idea why the sides are the way they are. We didn't remove any of the cement/mortar. We were using the shower before we tore it apart and the sides were this way, the walls had some sort of random insert walls on them (it's too big for a typical insert to fit so they pieced some together we think). The floor was the only part that was tiled but it was tiled directly onto this. The floor has a very large slope, I haven't measured it but I am pretty sure it's over the quarter inch per foot. Is that an issue too? (random thought there, sorry, lol)

What does "tie in the walls with that membrane" mean? Also, what type of professional does the drain/shower pan work? Tilers? Plumbers? I don't even know who I would call for such help.

[speed51133]

a competent tiler that has done showers should be able to handle it all. You'd want one that is TCNA certified (tile council of north America), and properly vetted. There are MANY hacks in this industry. Just because they say they have done it X way for 30 years does NOT mean anything. It should be done properly to TCNA AND local codes, along with manufacturers instructions.

When building a shower, wall board will be used onto which tiles are set with mortar. The wallboard, tiles, and grout are NOT waterproof. Some board, like cement board will not get damaged by water, but they will absorb it like a sponge and get surrounding stuff wet, like studs (a no-no).

The wall board should be waterproofed with some kind of membrane. Many available. The same goes with the floor. You want the wall membrane to tie into the floor so it is continuous. The floor can have a first slope, membrane, then a final slope, then tile. It can also have a first slope, membrane, then tile. It all depends on the kind of drain and kind of membrane used.

The slope of 1/4in per foot is industry standard minimum.

[Davy]

Yes, bust up the shower floor and curb, it's the most critical part of a shower. There's no way I'd go over what you have there.

[modismom]

Thank you. How does one go about busting it up? Also- I’m attaching a picture of the drain, how on earth do we remove it??

[speed51133]

google "demolition hammer". You can rent one at home depot. You do not need a full size one meant for highway destruction. That, a pry bar, and a mini sledge will suffice. You could just do it with a chisel and mini sledge if its only dry pack. It looks like it may be concrete though. Hit it a few times with a normal hammer and report back what happens, take a pic.

[modismom]

Just a normal hammer or a hammer on a chisel? How do we make sure to not damage the concrete floor underneath whatever this is? And any idea what we do to the drain? Just chip away around it? I’ll go do it and take pics- thanks SO much for your help. This is so overwhelming!

[modismom]

Ok it appears to be breaking off pretty easily with just a hammer. Can we hammer the whole thing??

[cx]

That would be my first suggestion. Unless you're in possession of an electric or pneumatic chipping hammer of some sort.

[modismom]

We got a good start with just the hammer! How do we remove it around the drain? The inside of the drain looks really bad(?) too- what do you think about that (see above pic). Thanks you guys!

[cx]

Elise, that's not even the correct type of drain for a shower receptor. It's gotta go one way or another. Once you get to it and chip out around it, you'll be better able to determine just how much of the drain and trap below it you'll need/want to replace.

At that point I'd recommend you give serious though to the feasibility of moving the drain to the center of the shower footprint.

Still more chipping in your future, so don't slack off now.

My opinion; worth price charged.

[modismom]

That would explain why it doesn’t look anything like all of the videos and articles we’ve watched/read. Lol. I would love for it to be in the center- this whole shower set up is so confusing. It is 67” x 34” and there were a lot of rotten/water damaged(?) studs we had to replace. Once we get it all chipped away from the drain I will definitely post a pic! Thanks again, all of your advice is so appreciated.

[Lazarus]

Without question, and since a new pan is pretty inexpensive....my vote is to tear it out.

[Kman]

If you find the drain to be cast iron, that's a very good reason to replace the riser and trap. It'll take some demolition of the slab around the drain, big enough to dig down and expose the trap to facilitate removal.

If the house was built back in the 70's or before, there's a good chance it's cast iron.