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Unread 05-17-2022, 09:33 PM   #1
sasteffl
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KERDI Channel or Tray not sloped properly. Best options to fix?

Long time, first time.

I've been reading here for several months as I built up the courage to try and build my own steam shower. Things were progressing nicely with my KERDI setup until I set the channel body and drain this past weekend.

I set my channel and presloped kerdi pan and came to find out that near the center of the pan the channel body seems to flex up and create a small bowl where the slope disappears. Meanwhile the edges are still perfectly presloped. Here's a video showing the issue:

How can I fix this?

My first thought is to use mortar to reslope the pan and put down a sheet of KERDI membrane. My biggest concern with that would be the excessive mortar under the membrane?

I could also do the dry pack method and put a membrane over that?

I took a video I can show but I don't have that privilege yet.

Looking forward to your feedback
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Unread 05-17-2022, 10:54 PM   #2
jadnashua
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It sounds like one or both of these things may have hit up your install so far:
- if there's any flex in the pan, the pan didn't get embedded and bonded properly to the floor
- the subfloor has issues

If the pan isn't well bonded, you might be able to cut that section out. It might just come up easily. Clean the thinset up, or fix the subflooring (or both), then bond it back in place and KerdiBand the seams.

A single slope mud bed is easier to fashion than a pan with a center drain and might work out better in the long term.
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Unread 05-18-2022, 05:40 AM   #3
sasteffl
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The pan is definitely bonded and it's a linear drain so I don't know that cutting out just a section is an option?

Is it possible to put a new very thin mud bed down over the top of the pan and then reapply a KERDI membrane?

If so, could I use Latictete 315 as the sloped mud and apply the KERDI directly on it?

Wish I could post a link to my video would help me explain it better. Any idea how I get that ability?
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Unread 05-18-2022, 07:45 AM   #4
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Hi Sam,

I think after three posts you'll be able to post links. We do that to discourage porn folks and other undesirables.

It sounds to me, though, that the pan is not bonded/supported in the area where the dip is. I know you've said it is, but still . . ..
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Unread 05-18-2022, 12:12 PM   #5
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If a section moves when pressed, nothing you do on top of it would end up stable.
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Unread 05-18-2022, 10:18 PM   #6
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Sam, you can post pictures now using the paper clip icon at the top of the reply box.

Or you can post a link with a space in it, and one of the moderators will remove the space and light up the link for you.

Or you can do both.
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Unread 05-19-2022, 09:15 AM   #7
sasteffl
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Thanks for the replies everyone. If a moderator is willing, I think it would be more helpful to see the video as opposed to just pictures.

Here's a link to the video: https: // photos.app.goo.gl/jJyYuXAQsbfcKiRw6
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Last edited by cx; 05-19-2022 at 10:20 AM. Reason: Light up Link
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Unread 05-19-2022, 03:47 PM   #8
jadnashua
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Code requires that the waterproofing be sloped. The tile is not waterproofing.

If the pan is tight to the subflooring, the subfloor (slab?) probably was not properly flat and level, and the foam just followed the surface underneath.
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Unread 05-19-2022, 04:13 PM   #9
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Are you setting the end of the level on the drain flange?

Do you have a longer level that you could set parallel to and across the drain and see if it's level?

I agree with Jim. If the pan is on the floor and it isn't sloped properly, then the floor wasn't flat/level.
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Unread 05-19-2022, 04:14 PM   #10
sasteffl
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@jadnashua - I understand that it's not to code and the tile is not 'waterproofing'. What's your recommendation to fix this?

@Kman - the level is being set on the drain flange.
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Unread 05-19-2022, 04:22 PM   #11
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Welcome, Sam.

I think you know in your heart of hearts you know the only reasonable fix is to remove that foam tray and make a properly sloped floor for your shower.

Always discouraging to to take large steps backward on a project, but I really see no other way if you want a properly constructed shower receptor.

I'd recommend you make your new floor using deck mud rather than the foam so you can get proper slope despite any deficiency in your substrate.

My opinion; worth price charged.
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Unread 05-19-2022, 07:37 PM   #12
sasteffl
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@CX Now that I'm thinking about this. The slab subfloor was pre sloped by my builder several years ago and I just set a flat based waterproof tray over a pre sloped slab... Is this the crux of the issue?

Here comes a streaming thought of questions that show my naivety.

Is it not possible to pour a new thin mud pan over the top of the foam tray?

Do I tear out the foam tray and just use the slab with either KERDI membrane over and cut the drain channel out and lower it?

Next question is... How do you cut the KERDI band out without damaging the walls or curb?

Do I need to buy a new channel body or is it possible to peel back the attached banding on it and reapply once I've fixed the slope?
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Unread 05-19-2022, 08:21 PM   #13
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I would say, probably.

1. No.

2. Without seeing what you've go, I can't say, but I can say I doubt the concrete finishers provided anything like what you really need there.

3. No, I would tear out the foam tray and create a mortar bed that is flat and properly sloped. Properly being a minimum of 1/4" vertical per horizontal foot.

4. No idea how your walls or curb were done. What you need is to be able to bond your new Kerdi that you'll put over your new slope to clean Kerdi material on the bottom of your walls and curb. Again, some photos would help.

My opinion; worth price charged.
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Unread 05-19-2022, 11:06 PM   #14
jadnashua
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Thinset is not designed to be applied as flattening, sloped material. Now, a thixotrophic slc can, but I'm not too sure how well it would work over a Kerdi foam tray. Shaping that to the proper slope would be harder than dealing with deck mud as it would tend to be sticky. Thixotropic stuff flows when agitated, but stays where it is when you stop, allowing you to build a slope with it.

To be consistent with the design on a Kerdi shower, you'd want a layer of Kerdi over the top.

If the existing tray has any spots that aren't bonded well, you'd need to either remove them, or tear the whole thing out.

Deck mud is one of the least expensive raw materials you can use for building your sloped pan. It's sort of like working with wet beach sand.
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Unread 05-20-2022, 05:20 AM   #15
sasteffl
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Here's photos.

Curb was made with 2" KERDI board and band. Channel body is KERDI with the pre adhered band on it.

If I tear out all the base banding and corners are they junk or can they be reused?
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