Mud Work Hints and Methods

[XrayX]

Can some one school me on why you would want to do all this mud work. Isn't their an easier and less time consuming way? Isn't the end result what maters and not what goes into it? I understand if it worked in the past it will again but to me it's like doing plaster instead of drywall. Not to put anybody down, think all the work looks great. Just wondering if its really the best way. I have done plenty of tile in the last 10 years and never done any mud. Still got all the tile done well without it. Stone, porcelain, u name it. Am I missing something?

[chuck stevenson]

Ray,

How would you prep those stairs other than mud as Davy posted?
Looks like all masonry grounds to me.

[XrayX]

Not sure, don't know what they looked like before. Just saying that I never ran across a situation where I thought that was a goog option. Maybe that's just me but just seems a bit old school. Like I sayed not knocking it just wondering why not a different method.

[ob1kanobee]

Durrock and mastic!

Ray when these guys do mud, everything is perfect for the tile. Square, plumb, level/pitched, solid, ect. ect. If you have never consistently tiled over perfect mud you wouldn't know what you are missing.

Today was one of those days I was tiling over out of plumb durrock with waves in the wall ect. ect. while installing listellos of glass, mosaics and 12" tile. I wish it was perfect mud. I would have been home hours ago. The finished work would of looked much better as well. When these guys do mud, they can mark one cut for a whole wall and make a dozen of them vs measuring every cut. Shower floors are exact dimensions.

[Chad Deiter Company]

If you start with concrete steps your kinda of limited into concrete to fix them right ? Maybe the treads and risers were all over the place.

[Brad Denny]

Having perfect concrete starts with prefect forms, and though I know little about concrete, I know it can be difficult to create perfect forms for stairs.

[Davy]

Not sure what other method would be better or easier. The steps were made of concrete blocks and then covered with a thick paint on membrane, Sonneborn or something like that. Of course the concrete blocks weren't made ready for tile. This set of steps leads from a court yard up to a balcony so they are out in the open. The pic below shows the Travertine at the top that covers the balcony. The balcony had about 1 1/4 mud at that riser so of course the treads needed mud to get the risers the same size.

Marty, I have done small steps like that, never a large set. I agree, it's a good way to do it. Being deco tiles, I couldn't bury these risers. I don't do these large sets very often, we did more in California where houses are built on the side of a hill all the time. Land is pretty flat around here.

These tiles are similar to Saltillo and are out of size real bad. Some have mortar and spots of paint on them, must be used tiles from somewhere.

[ob1kanobee]

Davy what I want to know is, how in the heck did you get out of the basement as you mudded the stairs?

Place looks kinda creepy from your photo. Is it haunted?

[XrayX]

I get that the tiling is much easier, but doer it really save you time? In the end the results should be the same. In reality I don't normally do cement board, nor do I want to. People really don't want to pay $ for prep work like that. I just deal with it. Like the stones song u can't always get what you want. I feel like I could do so much more but I would go broke. My skills are being limited by the reality of time is money. And every body needs money.

[Davy]

Ben said, "Place looks kinda creepy from your photo. Is it haunted?"

Had to laugh at that. It's not a basement, it's a set of steps that go up against the house and has a short wall on the outside of the steps. I'll have to get a better pic.

Under these steps is the basement. There are more steps going down there that we might tile.

Ray, I believe the code calls for risers to be within 3/8 from one another. Mud is about the easiest way to get them made right. If you mud them correctly, tiling is a breeze, no buttering up, just thinset them down.

[XrayX]

Stairs is one thing. I was more talking about the walls and floors. Still not convinced it is the most time efficient way. Also think the stairs should be in that range before tile. I just haven't done many stairs and most have been wood framing. So I guess I don't really know.

[Davy]

Ray, it's about what you're used to doing. Like anything else, you get fast at it after a while. My helper and I mud tub surrounds in about 2 1/2 hours, maybe 3 if you add the lath. To get a CBU wall as flat, it would take me longer. Everyone has their own way and I'm not knocking them, it's just what we do.

As for steps like in the pic, it's just nearly impossible for the concrete man to know exactly where to build the steps so they have the perfect heights, etc. The tile or stone thickness has a lot to do with it also. These tiles are 1 inch thick, something the concrete man wouldn't know. Sometimes the tile hasn't been decided when the concrete in being poured so they get it close and then we can mud it right where we want it.

[Chad Deiter Company]

Gotta love that perfect Satillo Sizing

[jwmezzanotte]

Ray

I have only done a few mud showers, so Im slow. But as has been said, its amazing to set over.
Just the other day I was on a job with two nearly identical (one has low ceiling so slightly less tile) tub surrounds. Like you, i am curious which is more cost effective. The drywall was typical, not flat or plumb. I just "dealt with it" on one, and did one coat of mud on the other.
Will have them grouted by sunday, so will update on time/material costs each. I also want to know, but remember that I am new, and pretty slow. Took me and a helper 4hrs to hang lath and finish the mud.

The costs im not sure of yet, but the mud tub is MUCH better! Its flat, plumb, and no lippage even with 50% offset. The walls are also much stronger.

[XrayX]

Let me know how it works out for you John. Also a few ?'ins how long before you can waterproof. Also a majority of my showers have niches some time more than one. Also some have rounded shapes. I been doing just fine with my current method but I do find the mud pack interesting.