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Unread 03-01-2021, 11:30 PM   #61
nmeyers
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Sorry CX, I'm rereading your previous response, and not getting any more clarity. I was thinking that using Schluter membrane, with kerdi band, and thinset in that corner, for example, is the waterproofing, not the caulking. It seems that you're saying that regardless of the glass panel, that is not a good waterproofing approach? Can you please help me see what I'm missing?
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Unread 03-01-2021, 11:42 PM   #62
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I see nothing at all wrong with your construction or waterproofing below the tile surface, Nick, my problem is depending upon a bead of caulk to provide both the physical horizontal support for the glass wall and the permanent waterproofing for that joint near the bottom of a shower receptor.

Those would be the only concerns if you were to set that glass panel directly upon the ceramic tile surface, which is subject to its own installation disaster. Tempered glass is surprisingly strong and durable with the exception of its edges. You can sit a 5x6-foot pane of 3/8th-inch tempered glass on a large grain of sand on a hard surface and almost instantly have a very loud noise, a large pile of glass beads and the potential need to change underwear. You need some sort of semi-soft material to set the glass edge upon, leaving a gap between glass and tile, which leads back to my concern about waterproofing and fastening with only a simple caulked joint.

Hope that clears it up a bit. You can certainly do what you've drawn, but I'd worry.

My opinion; worth price charged.
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Unread 03-02-2021, 12:30 AM   #63
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These go between the bottom of the glass panel and the tile they set on
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Unread 03-02-2021, 12:31 AM   #64
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They are trimmed flush with the surface of the glass before the bottom is sealed with clear silicone which is allowed to fully cure. Once cured it will hold the glass up just fine.
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Unread 03-02-2021, 09:47 AM   #65
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Thank you CX and Paul. I am definitely trying to avoid any underwear-changing incidents, at least not until the shower is operational

Just to clarify:

CX-I think what you're saying is you are not concerned about a failure because of the weight of the glass on the tile edge. It's that there will be a caulked joint where the glass changes plane with the tile that could fail and eventually allow water to penetrate horizontally onto the bathroom floor, or worse-allow the panel to move laterally. Is that correct?

And Paul I take it that in this type of installation you make no special structural alterations below that tile edge for it to support the glass panel? You just use the rubber shim pads and seal it with silicone. Is that correct?

Thanks again, Nick
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Unread 03-02-2021, 10:37 AM   #66
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Yes.
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Unread 03-02-2021, 01:55 PM   #67
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How long is the glass panel, Nick?

The glass guys used those plastic spacers/insulators for my glass panel. But I was concerned about the panels length, and just didn't think silicone alone was a long term solution in the even the panel gets bumped into so I specified a bracket on the floor. But my curbless design doesn't have that same ledge as yours, Nick, so the bracket was easy.
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Unread 03-04-2021, 02:03 PM   #68
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Replacing subfloor--tongue and groove considerations

Dan, I'm not sure the exact length of the glass panel but I have done some research on brackets and will likely use some to assist in holding it in place on the floor.

I upgraded to Advantech for my subfloor and I was just thinking it might be kind of awkward getting the tongue into the groove for my last pieces along the wall, no room to hammer. I have only installed T&G on new construction on an open deck where we didn't need to worry about this.

1. Do you all have any guidance on this procedure? Is it a bad idea to remove the tongue to facilitate fitting the last sheets in snug? Of course I'd reinforce the "tongue-less" seam with glued and screwed plywood strips underneath in between the joists. Or is it actually possible to easily slip those last pieces' tongues into the grooves without needing to cut it so as to leave too big of a gap next to the wall?

2.Is it overkill to still reinforce the T&G seams that I leave intact?

Thanks
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Unread 03-04-2021, 05:04 PM   #69
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1. Perfectly acceptable to do that, Nick. In remodel in small rooms I usually wouldn't even buy T&G sheets for that very reason. frequently only one joint to deal with and easy enough to add the blocking as you suggest. But sometimes you can cut your piece closely enough that you can kinda wedge it into place and use pry bars between the panel and the sole plate to move the tongue into the groove adequately. You want a quarter-inch or so gap at the wall anyway, eh?

2. Would indeed be overkill to my thinking. Nothing gained.

My opinion; worth price charged.
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Unread 03-04-2021, 09:16 PM   #70
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Thinsets

Thank you CX.
Just learned that my tile has arrived, and I've been reading up on thinsets, but am still a bit overwhelmed by the choices. I am setting 12x24 rectified porcelain on Ditra over Advantech (~120 sqft), and over kerdi membrane/board on the shower wall/floor (~120 sqft).

Now I know a lot of pros use modified over Ditra (and I'm in no rush to put this in use so drying time is not a concern), and was thinking Versabond modified LFT would be a good option, since it seems like it would be easier to work with for an amateur like myself, and help make sure I get good coverage.

But I have access to all the options nearby (mapei, bostik, TEC) and am willing to pay a bit more if it's recommended by someone such as yourself.

1. I know there is no way to come up with a "best" option, but any recommendations? I'm honestly facing some decision fatigue at this point and would gladly just take a suggestion rather than spending another minute on hold waiting to talk to another technical rep

2. Any opinions on sanding the Advantech before laying down the Ditra? Although it feels like a concrete slab underfoot it definitely seems a bit slick compared to plywood.
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Unread 03-04-2021, 10:29 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick
...and am willing to pay a bit more if it's recommended by someone such as yourself.
Mmmm, that would be someone you found on the internet and know absolutely nothing about, Nick?

For the record, thinset is a method of installing tile, not a product. Yes, the term thinset is used incorrectly in the industry far more than it's used correctly, but the cement based material most commonly used to bond ceramic and stone tiles to a substrate is thinset mortar.

1. If you're concerned with a Schluter warranty but wanna use a modified mortar, you'll need to use their own overpriced All-Set modified mortar. I've not tried it, but we have lots of reports that it is a good mortar and easy to use. For half the price you can buy VersaBond at your local Homer's and it is also a good mortar and easy to use. The other companies you mentioned all make some good mortars, too. Bostic makes the Schluter DitraSet, which is advertised as an un-modified mortar. I've used it and like it just fine and can testify that it acts much more like a modified mortar. Unfortunately, it's a bit pricey, too.

2. You absolutely must use a modified thinset mortar meeting ANSI A118.11 to bond the Ditra to the wood framed subfloor. Even Schluter agrees with that. Bonding to Advantech has been a subject of many, many discussions on these forums. We've had third-hand reports of tile setting materials manufacturers saying it's fine to use their mortars in that application. We've had other reports from folks who thought the surface of their Advantech was waxy feeling and didn't think it would bond well to thinset mortar.

It's been probably ten years since I've actually handled a sheet of that stuff and I do remember that feel. I never had intent to tile on any of it, so paid little attention. I do know it was developed specifically to resist moisture damage during construction and it did an excellent job of that.

If it won't absorb moisture, I would give it little hope of bonding well to thinset mortar, but I don't know if sanding will improve that. I'd suggest you bond some Ditra or a tile or something to a piece of it with the mortar you intend to use, let it cure for a week, and pull it off and see what you think. If it doesn't bond well, I'd recommend you consider using a CBU in lieu of the Ditra.

My opinion; worth price charged.
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Unread 05-02-2021, 04:48 PM   #72
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Floor Layout questions

CX, after reading a large portion of your 10,000+ posts on here, I think I know a little bit about you .

And if I can't trust you, I'm in trouble... I did some more checking about the advantech and made a lot of progress with plumbing and wall issues and am actually ready to set some tile.

Here is what I was thinking for my floor layout (12x24 porcelain, 3/8" thick). I'm going for a continuous grid that flows between the shower floor and the rest of the room. I like having a grout line in the middle of the shower, with symmetric tile.

My concern is that this layout has the glass panel sitting on ~4.5" rips of tile, especially since the edge of those tiles (that will hold the glass) will be slightly overlapping the short vertical tiles that make up the ~2" tall mini "wall" of the shower that follows the slope to the drain. (see sketch)

Am I being overly concerned about those rips coming up from the weight of the panel? Would having a full width of tile there instead be the way to go?

I could do that, it just would give asymmetric tiles on the shower floor, and the tiles wouldn't line up as pretty at the entrance to the room.
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Unread 05-05-2021, 08:10 AM   #73
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Hi, just bumping my previous post, hoping someone can offer some perspective.

I've talked to two local glass installers that have been around for decades. One said that it was fine to have the panel set like that (but preferable to have it an inch from the edge, to prevent breakage if holes are drilled partway through the tile to hold the clips). The other said they haven't done it like I described and would probably not recommend it.

Any guidance?

Thanks.
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Unread 05-05-2021, 10:42 AM   #74
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I don't see a problem with the glass being on the edge of the tiles. I see the concern about the tile breaking when drilling for the clips. I would want the glass fairly close to the edge and if possible, no clips at all. If the glass is set back from the edge of the tiles, the tiles on the shower side will need pitch on them. That's not a problem, you may have to put a grout joint directly under the glass.
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Unread 05-05-2021, 03:48 PM   #75
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Thanks a lot for the response Davy. I see your point and my layout idea was trying to avoid having a ledge for water to collect on inside the shower.

A follow-up question for you: are you not concerned about the glass on the tile edge, even if it's a 4 or 5 inch wide rip of the 12x24 (assuming I manage to get full coverage in setting them)?

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