Turbinator's Master Bath Remodel (w/pics)

[Turbinator]

Hi Mike, nice - thanks for the photos showing how you took out the floor. That's pretty much what I was thinking I might do too. A few questions for you:

How did you avoid running your saw into the staples / nails when you made the cuts? With the old linoleum in place, you can't really see where the staples / nails are, so there's a risk of running into them, I would think. And isn't that a bad idea for the saw blade?

Was there any specific reason why you needed to replace your underlayment? In general, are there good reasons not to have to replace it? (You can tell I'm trying to figure out if that extra work is necessary)

Thanks!
Turby

[ss3964spd]

Turby, no way, of course, to miss any fasteners when removing that layer in that way. You'd need to deem the saw blade sacrificial. I have several. If your blade is an especially good one you might consider picking up a demo blade, specifically made for that purpose. They aren't expensive.

IMO, sometimes you'll spend more time and energy trying to save the underlayment instead of removing it and replacing it. If you decide to try to save it by removing the vinyl/linoleum you might find that the adhesive under it is too hard to remove from the ply. Additionally, removing the top layer of ply will afford you the opportunity to screw down the subfloor to the joists if it isn't already.

[RifRaf]

I pretty much agree with everything that Dan had posted.

Originally Posted by Turby

How did you avoid running your saw into the staples / nails when you made the cuts?

In my bathroom, most of the staples used to fasten the underlayment to the subfloor were somewhat inline. If I started to cut a section of the underlayment and heard/felt the saw blade hitting a lot of nails/staples... I stopped cutting along my original path and just started a new cut a few inches to the left or right from my previous cut.

Originally Posted by Turby

Was there any specific reason why you needed to replace your underlayment?

I had to replace my underlayment because some of the underlayment plywood by the shower was damaged due to a leak. For me, it was just easier to remove and replace the bathroom's entire underlayment layer then having to scrape off a couple layers of "glued down" flooring.

[Turbinator]

If that's loose fill insulation I see, be ready for a whole mess of it when you take down that shower ceiling.

Dan, you speak from wisdom and experience! (Well, of course, you posted your photo of the aftermath of your blown insulation coming down)

I am checking out the ceiling and shop-vac'ing out the insulation, WOW there is a lot of it. Getting it before it falls down. Bagging it up. Can be reused?

Turby

[ss3964spd]

I needed to take down the entire ceiling in that bathroom and adjacent linen closet, so went into the attic with a snow shovel to relocate the blown in insulation. That one small piece of drywall was the ceiling of the linen closet, and was being held up with a single nail after I removed the drywall from the walls. Soon as I touched it with the shovel down it went!

Can definitely be re-used.

[Turbinator]

Hi everyone! Next major update - been hard at work slowly demo'ing the shower area. Progress to date, major milestone:


Above: All wooden posts, not load bearing, have been now removed and set aside. In addition, the shower's drop-ceiling design is also removed. The open ceiling directly above the shower now leads right up into the attic space. There is an electrical line that was located inside the post area that will need to be relocated elsewhere, probably through the walls.


Above: Another view of the shower stall area.


Above: Yet another picture of the shower stall area. You can see clear evidence of where my shower leak was -- the wood was soaked and is darkened. Probably some nasty mold / mildew. That wood will be removed and thrown away.


Above: Tub area is my next target! I'll be hacking away on this over the next couple of weeks.

Whew! I never realized just how much material goes into building a home. So many nails, wood, etc etc. Amazing. Saving much of the wood material, if it still looks good, in case I need it as part of my rebuilding phase, or in case I can use the wood for other projects. A lot of the material is in really good shape still.

No real questions for this update, though I will ask some more later on after I get through the tub removal phase. I have design questions running through my head and want to run ideas past the group here.

Happy Holidays, everyone!

Turby

[ss3964spd]

Without that drop ceiling and bulky framing and arches, even if you don't increase the overall footprint of the shower it's still going to be and feel much larger.

Get after that tub, man!

[Turbinator]

Wow... I guess all this OSB needs to come out and be replaced... not looking too healthy there...



Turby

[cx]

Maybe. Is it soft?

Can you poke a hole in it with a screwdriver?

Do you plan a second layer of subflooring in that area?

[Turbinator]

Originally Posted by cx

Maybe. Is it soft?
Can you poke a hole in it with a screwdriver?
Do you plan a second layer of subflooring in that area?

It isn't any softer than the surrounding non-water stained area, I noticed. I can't just poke a screwdriver through that part of the wood easily. But visually, there clearly is water damage. Part of me thinks I should just go ahead and look at replacing it -- I will assess as I move further along.

I will consider another layer of sub flooring in that area. I am thinking I may need to build up that section just to make it level with the rest of the bathroom area.

A couple of updates:


Above: Thanks to the builder approximately 16 years ago, this smashed beer can, a snipped pipe end, and a torn off piece of a potato chip bag were left behind in the tub enclosure. Yay!


Above: Yes, progress is slow. I couldn't help myself but to pull up some of the easily removed linoleum (it just peels right up with very little effort). Tub area is opened up for access. One more cultured marble wall panel is now taken off. Next up, the power saws come out and the tub gets taken apart.

Turby

[Turbinator]

Happy New Year, all! Hope everyone had a safe holiday season.

Back at it in 2023 with my latest demolition updates. If you're just tuning in, I'll be the first to admit that progress is slow, but steady. This is a one man show project and if I can't make time to hack away, nothing gets done.

Here we go with the latest updates:


Above: Tub is out! The only things left behind are the copper piping and the valves. The water lines are active, so I haven't yet figured out how I want to handle these just yet. I need to set about to picking my replacement tub so that I can get an idea what the new water line arrangement is going to need to be. Same goes for the black plastic drain piping, I've left that alone as well until I can figure out the new configuration.


Above: Closer view of the tub area.

Next steps - there's a small wood 2x4 framing nailed to the floor, I'll be taking most of that out before turning my attention elsewhere. I am going to head back to the shower area and will be taking out the OSB that is currently set around the shower flange. I also have to spend a bit of time breaking up debris material for discarding, before continuing with more demolition.

Turby

[Turbinator]

Hi folks,

Cleared away the underlayment, and cleaned everything up - will post pictures of that soon.

Looking for advice how to deal with the plumbing:



I will most likely be moving the location of the old tub's hot / cold water lines, and the drain. For now, for the copper piping AFTER the valves, is it common practice just to cut the copper pipe and discard it as I make plans for the new layout? And same for the tub drain's overflow drainage, the black pipe sticking up, just cut it as I plan the new setup?

For the tub copper piping, what's the two cylindrical pieces for? They look like expansion chambers but I'm not sure.

And final question, I saw and am enamored with PEX piping. Looks so easy to use and to install. Anyone super positive, negative, or neutral on PEX? I will spend some time on Google as well, plus will search this forum.

Thanks!

Turby

[cx]

If I understand the question, and you want to cut off and remove the copper line from the control valves to the faucet on the other side of the tub, yes, just do that.

The two new-looking copper pieces are most likely water-hammer arrestors. Whether they were ever actually needed there is a matter of conjecture. If they are of the type containing a bellows or piston of some sort, they technically do not require access. But that's something you'd need to sort out with your code compliance official.

The drain, if to be abandoned, I would likely just cut off as close to the main drain as convenient and cap. There are official requirements for terminating and abandoning such lines, but I'm not plumber enough to cite them for you. We've got a few folks as members here who can.

PEX tubing is a good thing and useful in many applications. You'll need to spend some dinero on the necessary tools for the type (and brand?) of PEX you elect to use. We (me, when I was still in business) stopped using copper below grade all together. Too many problems. But I still use copper regularly for repair, replacement, and remodel above grade in conditioned space. I have tools for PEX B in two brands and use that material when applicable. I've seen PEX A installed and frequently thought I'd like to try that, but I can no longer afford the several hundred dollars for tools when I'd rarely have use for the product. All a matter of what you think most applicable to your needs and willingness to buy tools. In general, I think having more tools is always a good thing.

My opinion; worth price charged.

[ss3964spd]

Turby, if you need to do something with those hot and cold supply lines so that you can finish your demo, you can simply install some compression fitting 1/4 turn ball valves. Turn the water off, cut the pipes in a spot where the pipes are smooth (to make sure the compression fitting will seal), install and tighten the fitting, make sure the valve is closed, turn the water back on. Maybe remove little handle.

[Turbinator]

Thanks guys, perfect advice, really appreciate it. I cut the copper pipe after the valves for now, to get the extra piping out of the way. Also trimmed the tub overflow black pipe but will refrain from cutting more until I plan the location of the new drain.

I will look at installing the shut off valves for both hot / cold - great idea. Thought about it but wasn't sure if that was common practice or advisable. Seems logical to me. I am planning on opening up the subfloor a little bit to allow for some pipe rework and cleanup... lots of debris stuck under there from the home builders.

Speaking of debris, in fact, I found this...



I'm all for a good time, but I don't know about mixing alcohol and power tools, and certainly I think it's poor practice to leave your trash behind in a customer's home.. the home was built in 2006, so this is probably about 17 years old at this point. It's going into the recycle bin.

Turby