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Unread 03-28-2005, 01:51 PM   #1
trout
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cement board on concrete

When I finish my basement, I will be using a Dricore subfloor for the carpeted areas. The dricore panels are approx 7/8" thick....then carpet can be installed on top of that. I'd like to use creamic tile for the area around my bar.

As I see it, I've got 2 options.

1. Install tile directly onto the cement floor and just live with the height difference between carpeted area and tile area. Not a very desirable option.

2. OR could I lay down a 1/2" cement backer board onto the cement. I'm thinking that the total height of thinset + 1/2" cement board + thinset + 1/4" ceramic tiles will be about 1" high.

So as of now, I'm liking option 2 better because the finished floor height of the carpeted area will be very similar to the finished floor height of the tiled area. My question is should I be concerned about installing the cement board over the concrete floor? Should I install the same way as if I were installing over wood? Everything I've seen seems to indicate that the cement board be used over plywood and screwed down into wood. I haven't been able to find anything in regards to applying it over concrete.

thanks in advance.
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Unread 03-28-2005, 02:05 PM   #2
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You can thinset the CBU directly to the concrete. The concrete should be free of any sealers. It's still a good idea to tape all your joints with CBU tape and thinset.
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Unread 03-28-2005, 02:11 PM   #3
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Backerboard is supposed to be nailed or screwed to the subfloor. Only the foam core backerboards (Wedi, for example) are rated for a thinset application.
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Unread 03-28-2005, 02:26 PM   #4
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But then not all are either. Customs easy board is not rated for floors. Just counter tops or walls. Why not just mud the floor to build up the height difference. Isn't dri core like 1" thick from bottom to top?
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Unread 03-29-2005, 07:30 AM   #5
trout
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Thanks for the feedback everyone

Quote:
Originally Posted by bljack
But then not all are either. Customs easy board is not rated for floors. Just counter tops or walls. Why not just mud the floor to build up the height difference. Isn't dri core like 1" thick from bottom to top?
Yes, the dri core is approx 7/8" thick. I really don't know much about mudding, so initially, laying down cement board seemed like the more straightforward way to go. Maybe I should look into your suggestion. Any references I can check out?

bbcamp---although I didn't specifically mention it, I was thinking about using tapcon fasteners at least on the corners of each panel.
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Unread 03-29-2005, 08:13 PM   #6
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Welcome aboard, Trout.

The only board specifically rated for thin set application that I know of is Wedi, which is hard to get. None of the other boards are approved for over concrete since fastening is precarious at best.

Mud or self leveling cement is the best way to go. Whatever it is will have to be bonded to the concrete, not fastened with screws, etc.
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Unread 03-29-2005, 08:40 PM   #7
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I know that the cement board companys don't approve of thinseting their boards to concrete, because it can't be fastened with screws or nails.

The key word is approve. Why wouldn't it work, thinseting a piece of cement to cement, and then tiling over it. It would be the same as tiling over tile.
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Unread 03-29-2005, 09:32 PM   #8
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Awww, Matt, don't start that over here, you'll make the visitors crazy.

But if you started a thread inna Professional's Hangout, it might get some fun responses from some of the reps, eh?
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Unread 03-29-2005, 11:05 PM   #9
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Quote:
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Mud or self leveling cement is the best way to go. Whatever it is will have to be bonded to the concrete, not fastened with screws, etc.
All in favor of slc..........aye

all in favor of other stuff...............................

The slc's have it
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Unread 03-30-2005, 01:47 PM   #10
trout
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Bridge
Welcome aboard, Trout.

The only board specifically rated for thin set application that I know of is Wedi, which is hard to get. None of the other boards are approved for over concrete since fastening is precarious at best.

Mud or self leveling cement is the best way to go. Whatever it is will have to be bonded to the concrete, not fastened with screws, etc.

Thanks everyone!

Some local 'professionals' that I've called in my area don't see anything specifically wrong with using cement board over concrete to raise the floor level up 1". They've just never done it before.

Soooo the concensus seems to build a mud bed. I've been reading up on this site. the mud bed articles seem to be in reference to a shower install, so it usually requires pan liners or the Kerdi method, etc. I simply want to raise the level up 1" so that it will be level with the DriCore system for my carpet.

Will my project simply entail..

1. using a wood lath or something removable for the contour form around the future tiled area.
2. mix up some mortar using the mud recipe in the 'how to build a shower' article in the Liberry
3. spread mud, building up to desired thickness, smooth out.
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Unread 03-30-2005, 02:23 PM   #11
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Add one more step just before you place the mud on the concrete: Paint the concrete with a slurry of thinset that's been mixed a bit on the runny side.
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