Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile

Welcome to John Bridge / Tile Your World, the friendliest DIY Forum on the Internet


Advertiser Directory
JohnBridge.com Home
Buy John Bridge's Books

Go Back   Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile > Tile & Stone Forums > Tile Forum/Advice Board

Sponsors


Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Unread 10-15-2018, 10:42 AM   #1
Mogli
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 27
New curbless Neo-angle shower advice please

Hi all. I am planning a new bathroom in a new addition. It is a slab on grade in south Florida. Attached is similar to what I hope to do.

I have read through several posts on this excellent site and elsewhere, and have a few things I want to ask you all or confirm with you:

1. I am planning to use a 36"x36" neo-angle enclosure (like the Vigo brand from HD) and going curbless. One post comment suggested 36"x36" is too small to do curbless because water will get everywhere. I hope to ignore this advice but will mitigate by making the whole small bathroom a wet room. I want curbless for the look and to save space.

2. how deeply do I recess the slab? Surprisingly I could not find a slab recess detail online that had dimensions.

3. How does the steel reinforcing in the recessed part of the slab integrate with the steel in the main part of the slab (the whole slab is new)? Is the rebar just bent down into the recessed part?

4. Do I need a two-stage drain for slab on grade in Florida? I do not understand the "exception" in Florida building code that might allow me to do a simpler flange if I use a liquid membrane. The simpler flange connection and liquid membrane seems a lot cheaper and easier.

5. If I go with a system like Kerdi or USG Durock, they don't seem to make a pre-sloped pan (base? liner?) for neo-angle showers with a linear drain. Any other competitor that does? Can I use their rectangular pan and trim it down? This would create a slope slope only to one wall, not to the corner or center.

6. I initially wanted to use the same wood-look tile to be in the bathroom in the shower too, and use a linear drain. I got scared off of the idea due of a compound slope being more difficult and the tiles where wall meets floor looking crooked. Is this concern justified?

7. I love the look of a linear drain. Several posts here suggest a more traditional center drain and small tiles for a neo-angle shower. Is there a way i can do a linear drain in a neo-angle shower that is done right & well?

I have more questions. However, answers to these will really help me settle on a plan. Thanks in advance for your input!

Mogli
Attached Images
 
__________________
Mogli
Mogli is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Unread 10-15-2018, 11:24 AM   #2
Davy
Moderator -- Mud Man
 
Davy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Princeton,Tx.- Dallas area
Posts: 33,722
Your slab has a thick beam around the perimeter. I avoid busting into this beam any more than I have to. I wouldn't want a linear drain at the outside perimeter of the slab (outside wall) because with most linear drains, you have to remove more concrete than you do with a center drain. They are always coming out with new products so someone might mention a low profile linear drain that I haven't seen.

A 3x3 shower is pretty small. You can have a curbless (or very small curb) and still have a glass door (like your pic shows) or even a curtain. That would help keep the water contained.
__________________
Davy

www.davystephenstile.com
Davy is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-16-2018, 06:49 AM   #3
John Bridge
Mudmeister
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Rosanky, Texas
Posts: 68,525
Send a message via AIM to John Bridge
Hi Mogli,

You say this is a new addition, so the concrete hasn't been poured yet?

The recess can be any depth that accommodates your plan. If I were doing it I would recess a couple inches and then form my shower floor with mortar, bringing it up to the level of the outside slab and pitching it toward the drain, which would have already been installed. A surface waterproofing system would then be used prior to tile installation.

A problem that comes to mind though, is getting the outside slap level and flat when pouring the concrete. It's not easy to do.

As to ready made foam shower floors, Durock offers custom made ones. You send in a schematic drawing, and they make the floor and ship it to you. Check with your Durock shower dealer.
John Bridge is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-16-2018, 08:01 AM   #4
Mogli
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 27
Thanks for responding John.

So in your recommendation, I would not need to do a pre-slope mortar bed and a waterproof membrane draining to a two stage drain, then final sloped mortar bed? If not, a two-inch recess seems plenty to build a mortar bed that slopes only 3/4" over 36"

As for your comment about slabs not being level and flat, do you just mean that the foundation contractors don't tend to smooth the slab well enough to be tile ready?

Thanks for the tip on the custom Durock foam.
__________________
Mogli
Mogli is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10-16-2018, 11:00 AM   #5
Davy
Moderator -- Mud Man
 
Davy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Princeton,Tx.- Dallas area
Posts: 33,722
I see now, the slab isn't poured yet. How you have the slab poured depends on the type base you decide to use. Like John said, it's best to recess the slab a few inches in the shower area. Then it can be built up with more cement when you get to that point.
__________________
Davy

www.davystephenstile.com
Davy is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-07-2018, 08:38 AM   #6
Mogli
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 27
shower wall tile near pocket door

Hi All,

I am planning a new, small bathroom in which one wall of a shower enclosure is against a wall that holds the recess for a pocket door. Pic attached. I plan to use 6x36 tiles on the shower walls.

Should I be concerned that the pocket-door wall is too flimsy to support wall tiles? Any other reason it is a bad idea to have a shower against a pocket door recess?

Thanks,

Mogli
Attached Images
 
__________________
Mogli
Mogli is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-07-2018, 08:46 AM   #7
Carbidetooth
Hmmmmm
 
Carbidetooth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Boise, ID
Posts: 1,650
Yes you should be concerned.

If it were me, I'd essentially build a wall in front of the pocket door frame. It could be 2x2 if done well and attached to pocket frame.


Have seen others here plate wall with plywood, but I'd want more beef there.


Assuming it gets used, I might also take the opportunity to change the pocket door hardware to Johnson. Around here the cheapest crap seems to be standard and it makes a somewhat functional thing into a PIA. I fix that for clients because it's near impossible to do later.
__________________
Peter

Silicone (not silicon) Sealant Ranger
Carbidetooth is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-07-2018, 09:05 AM   #8
ss3964spd
Moderator
 
ss3964spd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Fairfax, Va
Posts: 4,688
Send a message via Yahoo to ss3964spd
Can you frame the pocket door wall with 2X6's instead of 2X4's?

Using 2X6's would allow you to use 2X's on the flat instead of using the steel wrapped 1X material in the Johnson kits. You might also consider making the perpendicular short side walls of the shower knee walls, adding a lot of rigidity.
__________________
Dan
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If I recall correctly my memory is excellent, but my ability to access it is intermittent.
ss3964spd is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-07-2018, 09:37 AM   #9
Mogli
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 27
Thanks to both of you for the good advice. I think I will just switch to an outswinging door and avoid all the problems of a pocket door altogether.
__________________
Mogli
Mogli is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-07-2018, 10:33 AM   #10
Winter River
DIYer with more projects than time
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 275
A couple ideas: Pedestal sinks are much nicer to look at from the front, with the pipes hidden. Consider turning it 90 degrees so it looks its best from the door. Have you thought about swapping the location of your toilet and shower? If you put the shower in the corner where the toilet currently is, you wouldn't have to worry about the pocket door wall being strong enough for tile.
__________________
Elise
Winter River is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-07-2018, 11:21 AM   #11
Mogli
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 27
Rearranged

Thanks for the tip and suggestion Elise. I didn't ask the drafter to specify a pedestal sink, he just chose it. I think it makes sense though since this is small and sort of a guest bathroom.

The attached pic rearranges the toilet and shower as you suggested. (This is in Visio, not AutoCAD, so not exactly to scale.) It certainly solves the pocket door + tile issue. The only problem I see with it is that the shower door must either swing into the sink or into the toilet.

I'd love to hear anyone's opinion on the two alternatives.
Attached Images
 
__________________
Mogli
Mogli is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11-09-2018, 01:32 PM   #12
Winter River
DIYer with more projects than time
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 275
There are neoangle shower doors that slide open instead of opening into the room, for example: neo angle sliding door. There are also rounded styles that slide open. Neither choice is as clean looking as a frameless hinged door because of the bottom track, but the space saving considerations are substantial.

Your bathroom plan is starting to look familiar: Alumni Photo Album
__________________
Elise
Winter River is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 01-11-2019, 12:35 PM   #13
Mogli
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 27
Framing near new door

Thanks again to all who responded. I know this is a tile forum, but does anyone know how to attach the new exterior wall that abuts the existing exterior wall? near bottom right in the diagrams. I am guessing double studs in the new wall bolted to the existing stud in the existing wall?
__________________
Mogli
Mogli is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-25-2020, 12:03 PM   #14
Mogli
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 27
Update: shower tray or dry pack?

Hello from years ago! My project is moving along finally and I'm about ready for drywall.

Between the plumber and the slab contractor, the back wall of the shower is 2-1/2" away from the recess that was built into the poured slab (top of picture). If I drypack the recess, is it fine for that small area (around 1-1/2" after cement board and wall tile are in) to not be sloped? Or can/should I build up that area a smidge when applying thinset? Or should I grind down that edge to slope?

Alternatively, can I still use something like a Schluter shower tray instead of drypack given the extra 1-1/2"? I read somewhere (probably here) - and I quote - "most homeowners have no business trying to drypack a shower base."

Thanks in advance!
Attached Images
 
__________________
Mogli
Mogli is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-25-2020, 01:03 PM   #15
cx
Moderator emeritus
 
cx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Boerne, Texas
Posts: 94,564
I think the simplest solution would be to fur out those walls to match the recessed shower footprint. I rarely fill those those recesses all the way to the slab elevation, but if you wanna do that, grinding a slight bevel on those perimeter sections should be all you need. You want to consider that you want the entire perimeter level. Don't know what you intend on the other two walls, but keep that level perimeter in mind. Shouldn't be much of a problem as you'll need very little depth to achieve the necessary 1/4" per foot slope.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mogli
I read somewhere (probably here) - and I quote - "most homeowners have no business trying to drypack a shower base."
I certainly hope it was not here.

Absolutely no rocket surgery involved in creating a sloped mud bed for a shower floor and we've had hundreds of DIY visitors do their first tile shower with such mud beds. No reason at all you shouldn't do yours that way.

My opinion; worth price charged.
__________________
CX

Y'ALL NEW VISITORS READ THIS HERE!
cx is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Stonetooling.com   Tile-Assn.com   National Gypsum Permabase


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Curbless Shower install Advice skoppes Tile Forum/Advice Board 2 09-11-2018 06:30 AM
Seeking advice for curbless shower on slab. dedvalson Tile Forum/Advice Board 5 05-06-2016 08:04 AM
Wanting to create a curbless/wetroom shower and need advice NewBathroomGuy Tile Forum/Advice Board 26 01-04-2015 04:44 PM
Curbless shower liner advice needed projectspat Tile Forum/Advice Board 28 12-09-2014 09:57 PM
Advice on Curbless shower floor sdunt Tile Forum/Advice Board 3 03-06-2008 01:49 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:19 AM.


Sponsors

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2018 John Bridge & Associates, LLC