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Old 06-19-2018, 11:11 AM   #1
smifwal
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Power grout bleeding

A buddy of mine a GC had his guys do the tile in his last flip house. They are youtube quality installers. Anyway he got a call from the the people that bought and they did a nice deep clean on the shower and bam it is running down the wall. I told him first guess is that the used too much water and it didn't cure to its potential strength. It was installed about 6 months ago. I know I just saw a thread on this but it was Laticrete I think. I am confident that this is a installer error cause I know they eyeball it and they are not that good, but I figured I would see if anyone else has had this problem with power grout and possible remedies short of digging it out.(that would be my recommendation)
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Old 06-19-2018, 11:34 AM   #2
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http://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin/...d.php?t=121779

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Old 06-19-2018, 12:07 PM   #3
smifwal
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Thanks lou. Sounds like my assumptions were correct in the amount of water used. And over washing when claening
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Old 06-19-2018, 01:02 PM   #4
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Wasn't Power Grout the one they were sending out a hardener to treat the grout due to that problem?
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Old 06-19-2018, 01:44 PM   #5
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I forgot to upload the photos
Attached Images
  
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Old 06-19-2018, 08:28 PM   #6
Karls tile Inc
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Wow thats crazy! I have never seen anything like that before and I hope never have that problem. Hope everything works out for the installers. However I bet that they get blamed instead of it actually being a product defect.
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Old 06-19-2018, 09:11 PM   #7
smifwal
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Karl This guy is a good friend of mine but he is a jack of all trades. He is self taught in the tile dept.and his guys are learn as they go. I have tried to guide him on the richious path with the tile. But his guys don't listen, they look at me like I am crazy when I measure water and material telling me it is faster to just do it by feel the irony is that they wouldn't know what the feel is. I did his tile work for a while but he realized that it was cheap to pay his guys so I follow them to do the carpet and I always point out the things they did wrong, missed cuts,chipped tiles,washed out grout,shotty layout choices. I have told him multiple times that he is never going to get future work out of the shit they do. I am going to tell him that he needs to tear it all out and replace it maybe this will help him listen to me when I tell him to do things the right way.
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Old 06-20-2018, 02:06 PM   #8
Christopher A. Kain
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Shawn,

I agree with you 100% that it's worth it to measure the water every time and mix according to the directions. I'm the Area Technical Manager for TEC and I do that for all my training sessions (Surface Prep, Mortars, and Grouts) and there's always someone who makes a comment. But, I know the product will mix and perform correctly. I leave my sample boards behind because I know they'll stand up because I used them correctly.

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Old 06-21-2018, 05:34 AM   #9
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Shawn
The only grout we ever had problems with was the TEC Power Grout. We are sticklers for water measurement. In this day and age we shouldn't be having these problems. Companies have to stop using us as R&D guinea pigs.
Switch to Laticrete Permacolor or my favorite, Mapei Ultracolor FA. Step up to the Flexcolor CQ from Mapei and if you need an epoxy, Laticrete Spectalock Pro.
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Old 06-21-2018, 06:59 AM   #10
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Hey devil dog, I personally use flexcolor cq unless it is a shiny tile. I have let him use it before and he said it was too hard to work with His get a smoking discount at lowes, in my region they sell to Tec so he orders everything all at once. The funniest thing to me is he is a cheap bastard and spends as little as possible on his flip houses but drops $30.00/bag on power grout. Makes no sense, why not get the cheap stuff if you don't care about the end user
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Old 06-22-2018, 12:44 AM   #11
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First of all, this may be the worst case of grout failure I have ever seen , online pictures included.

This being said, I just recently encountered a serious (serious enough to warrant a claim with TEC, grout residue on rag after getting wet during shower after approx 7 day full-dry cure time , and now over a month of natural cure time) problem at a job I finished in the early days of May. While this is only anecdotal for now, both my eyes and my gut tell me that TEC (yet again?!) altered the formula of their Power Grout 550, as I have not had any issues with 550 installations in 2017 ranging from May to November.

I obviously reread the bag for the most recent installation in 2018, and their directions as far as the amount of water to use are laughable at best. If my memory serves me right, for a 10 lbs bag the range for how much water to use was from 3.25 cups to 4 cups (64-80 fl oz.). If that isn't a wide, ambiguous and thus completely unprofessional range, then I don't know what is. In addition, their directions say - "use as lowest amount of water required for initial mixing for 2 minutes - add more water if necessary (would be nice if they could be more precise than necessary here already) - let it slake for 5 minutes - remix for 1 minute". In other words, you mix it initially, then believe you may need a bit more water, but wait, you cannot remix it with more water right away - you both cannot add more water during the first two minutes, and you cannot remix the grout until the 5 minute slake period is over. This sounds to me like TEC is saying that the first time around when you mix it, you will more than likely be low on the amount of rwater used, but then you will only have one very narrow window to approximate how much water to add to make the grout texture appropriate (by TEC standards).

Now that I have taken all the necessary photographs of this issue, filing a claim with TEC is my next step. If they expect me to even consider any future use of their brand-name products, they will need to offer an appropriate and commensurate solution. I will gladly stand by my work, or take every inch of responsibility for work and mistakes done by my helpers, but I have a serious issue with having my professional reputation and name negatively affected by what seems to now be very common issue with certain batches of TEC Power Grout.
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Old 06-22-2018, 04:25 PM   #12
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Bart,

I'm sorry to hear you're having an issue with Power Grout. I'd like to discuss your Power Grout issue and help you through your project.


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Old 06-23-2018, 04:44 PM   #13
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If you would like to help, revert Power Grout to pre 1/17 formula. You guys mucked with it and you wouldn't be supplying distributors with hardener if there wasn't a issue.

Inferring that anyone having issues didn't use recommended water amount or mix correctly is disingenuous. Plenty of nitwits in this industry to be sure, but Im quite literate and capable of mixing, so much so that Ive been using permacolor select for over a year with zero issues. As I was with Power Grout before I switched.

When large groups of installers all start having issues with a product at once, then somethings not right. I would have stayed a Tec customer if I was given a genuine answer, not you need correct water, air temperature, water temperature to get good results.

You guys do realize that we don't work in a climate controlled lab I hope. If your product is spec'd as such,you need to change it so it works in the real world, on a jobsite.
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Old 06-23-2018, 09:09 PM   #14
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Exclamation

The power grout bleeding issue is a pretty well known problem in the installer world. Could installer error be a cause? Sure, but I can say this is at least the 50th time I've seen this issue between all the forums and FB groups I frequent in the last year.
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Old 06-25-2018, 02:56 PM   #15
Christopher A. Kain
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Jeff, I was just agreeing that mixing correctly and following directions offers the best results. I'm not familiar with your issues and never meant to imply anything was your fault. I'm available if you'd like to discuss anything in more detail.

Thanks,
Chris
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