Question for Kelly, John, and the other wood workers

Kelly and John

Have you ever used diamond sharpening stones for your wood chisels? Are they better than the old whetstones I have ?

What say you?

Z

[Barbs]

Barbs' husband here. I may be a tile-wanna-be, but woodworking is one of my passions. The answer is yes and no. In a straight exchange, the diamond sharpeners are better. With more use they stay level longer. Staying level is a big part of getting a good sharp edge on tools. On the other hand, they are very hard to level once they start to show wear. They are very EXPENSIVE compared to the old whetstones. Another way to go, are Japaneese Wet Stones. They work very well and are easy to re-level. However, you need to have 2-3 grit stones (400 to 800 to 1200 for the best results). They are very resonably priced. They level nicely, use water as the grinding medium and do an excellent job. If you have extra money to spend, you can go with the diamond stones. If you want to try something cheaper, and are willing to try something very few people use, go with the Japaneese Wet Stones. Of course, I could easily find a dozen people who would recommend Diamond over whetstone, whetstone over diamond and Japansse Wet Stones over/under both. It's really a preference and there are good arguments for all of them.

Gee... wasn't that helpful????

Curt (Barbs' Husband)

[cx]

Nope, never have tried them, Rob. Only diamond sharpening things I've ever tried are them there vee shaped things that you run your pocket knife through. Makes them sharper, sure nuff, quick too, but seems to take off a lot of metal, too.

I rarely even use my water whet stones any more. Have found I can make pretty damn sharp on the belt sander that's always set up in another shop here on the property and it's usually good enough. When I need really, really sharp, I still get out the two stones I've had for eons and a wooden jig that sits across a sink so's I can dribble water on'em. Both could use a serious flattening as Curt suggests, but I'm not equipped to do that. So, I make do.

If you get you some diamonds, do report back. Doubt John has one, too "new fangled" for him, I bet.

Hi guys,

Thanks for the input. I was in Lowes the other day (getting toggle bolts, NOT tile), and they had two of the diamond thingys on display ($20 a piece, two different grits). I have all of Grandpa's whetstones (some very old)that I use. Maybe I'll just stick with the old methods.

Kelly, using a belt sander, huh? Sounds quick and easy. What grit? I'll try it.


Curt, a carpenter I worked with years ago told me about the time he worked with some Japanese carpenters, and how they performed miracles with stones and sharpening everything by hand. The stones were getting rough and unlevel, and the boss muttered something about "get trueing stone". This guy I was working with said he was thinking "what the hell is a trueing stone?"

One of the helpers came back from the truck with the infamous trueing stone...it was a clean concrete block soaking in a bucket of water, and they ran all the whetstones over it to grind them flat.

Any body else have the problem of having your good chisels somehow get abused like the demo chisels? Even though they are kept in separate toolboxes and hidden from view?

Z

[Sonnie Layne]

Hey Z,

Simple solution to the abused chisel thingy. I keep a couple of cheapies in my diddy bag for all to see, use and occasionally steal. They think they're getting away with something. Those are my "framing chisels".

The really good ones hide out safely in another tool kit which from the outside looks so uninteresting nobody ever pays any attention. I also keep my job-site honing stones there, use oil as a lube.

So what composite/stone is the old Case Moonstone? Whatever it is I keep one in the kitchen for my kitchen knives. Not good for sharpening, great as a hone.

S

[John Bridge]

Hi Curt,

Always room for another woodworker here.

I've got only one stone, and I can't even remember where it came from. It drinks oil and has different grits on each side. In fact, you can see the division by looking at the side of it.

I've made an angle guide out of wood that will hold a chisel or gouge as you pass the tool over the stone. I have by no means achieved a "factory" edge on anything I've attempted to sharpen, but I've come close.

I've read a couple articles about the Japanese stones (their saws, too).

What do you think about a motorized "hone"? I'm looking in that direction.

As stones go, what about the "Arkansas White"?

[cx]

John:

I have a stone that is REALLY course on one side and "Soft Arkansas" on the other. Used to be an oil stone but I always use it with water now, when I use it at all.

Have another, much finer stone that is "Hard Arkansas". It is white in color, kinda looks like alabaster, which may be what you are calling "Arkansas White". It rarely gets used at all, but it will put an edge like a razor if used correctly. Also use it with water.

Have a couple other smaller (above stones are about 2x8 or 9 inches) stones that are alleged to be Arkansas stones of some grit or hardness. They all work quite well if a fella will just take the time to use the damn things.

Do we know if Arkansas Stones come from Arkansas? Do we know just what kinda rock they really are?

Sonnie:

I too will frequently lend the 1" chisel in my tool belt, which is also a "framing chisel" as you suggest. Have two or three others that size and half a dozen other sizes in tool buckets in the truck and trailer for when I need a square, sharp chisel for my own use. Rarely is anyone actually foolish enough to axe to borry them ones. Some of them surely don't even look like something anyone would WANT to borrow, let alone steal, which is a large plus.

Also have a couple square lathe tools in the bucket, which I find very useful as chisels in some circumstances. Could even turn something flat - if I had a lathe. Too bad don't nobody have one for sale cheap, eh?

Sonnie, this is what I usually say when someone wants to borry a chisel.

It still seems that even with the distractors planted for the wood butchers to use, I still end up with nicks in the good chisels. I even bought a nice leather pouch to keep them in.

I think this goes in the same unexplained category of why I lose so many scribes, pencils and utility knives.

Z

PS Do ya have a recipe for "shrimp with grits"?

[Bud Cline]

Rob you can rest assured that you are not losing your utility knives.

Utility knives just simply vaporize every three to five weeks without explanation. Usually in the middle of the night.

All of them do it. The $5 ones, the $15 ones. They all do it.

A-n-n-n-d-d-d-d...chisels weren't meant to be sharp more than fifteen minutes after they are removed from their original package.

[Barbs]

Hi John,

Sorry to take so long getting back to you, a busy day yesterday.

I like the wet grinders. I've been thinking of adding one to my tool collection. I just haven't had the time to do the research. When I do, I'll let you know what I find out.

To answer your question about "Arkansas White" Stones, they are very good. The ratings on the stones have to do with the density or coarseness of the stone. They are rated differently, usually by the manufacture. They range from simply, soft and hard, to soft, hard, true hard and translucent. The "white" is usually referred to the hard or fine stone. But, the white color can actually be any hardness except translucent. And yes, they originally do come from Arkansas. Though there are also man-made stones that are sometimes call Arkansas Stones. Unless they state them as "natural", you just can't tell. Hope this helps,

Curt

[John Bridge]

I've been watching power hones in tool catalogs for years, but have never run into anyone who's owned one. One of the things I wonder about is how much it costs for a new stone for the thing. The stones are quite thin, and I doubt they could be trued.

My helper has some sort of "Arkansas" he shapens his knife on. He gets it like a razor.

[Barbs]

Guys,

I've found that Curts' chisels and utility knives are the perfect tool for cleaning the weeds out from the cracks in the driveway. Maybe that's why he's so good at sharpening them.

Barbs

Bud

Thanks for the moral support.


Barbs

AAAUUUUGGGHHHH!!!

[flatfloor]

OK peoples, from someone who has a set of chisels with rust on them, that is I think they do, if I can find them. What is honing v sharpening?

And Bud your are right about utility knives as well as pens and pencils. I also think computer cables, video and audio wires all have sex around that time, which is why no matter how often I straighten them out, they are tangled when I want to move something.

Rob, what's wrong with using chisels to clean up?

[John Bridge]

Jim,

Honing is sharpening. To put an edge on a tool like a chisel you may have to grind it. Then you hone it on a stone. It just happens that they call the electric tool a "hone."