Chinese Botticino Beige Marble [Archive] - Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile

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Ozarkite
02-29-2008, 07:51 PM
Product of China. No brand on box. Botticino Beige, pattern M123, shade No. 2. 5 each 12 x 12 tile per box. Mostly 3/8 thick, tile not gauged. Highly polished,(already has some light scratches). Actually just a smidgin over 12 inches square...varies from 1/32 to 1/64...so far.

Opened 2 out of 10 boxes and 6 out of the 10 tile had from dime sized to nickel sized "dead spots/rough stone" places on mostly the surface near the edges of the tile. Also had very small chips on edges...not very many, but one is too many. Very small chamfer on edge...no more than 1/16.

Also had very deep and wide veins,(open, not tight), and looked like if you tapped these things, they would break easily. These "flaws" would be very easily seen when these are laid. I figured 1/16 spacing. Yes, I could carefully orientate the tile so that the "flaws" could not be as easily seen, but it would be interesting, to say the least. The floor these go on has a window at the end, lighting up the floor like a lighted mirrow would be, almost.

My question is: Is this typical of this type marble?

I think, but am not sure, that these tile came from Home Depot. The little marble I have used came from Italy...and was nothing like this stuff.

Thank you in advance for any input you may have...

Carroll

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Lazarus
02-29-2008, 08:16 PM
Carroll~ Italian products are, IMHO, generally very good. The Chinese have "cashed in" on this particular market as of late. I have NOT been impressed with their "Natural Stone" products. I did, recently install about 2,000 sq. ft. of a "Face Porcelean" that was actually pretty good.....for the price. For marble, however, I would stick to a good Italian import. They have been around far longer than the recent imports......

ceramictec
02-29-2008, 08:17 PM
I would say what you purchased isn't the best of marble.
most Bottocino is very light, smooth and clean looking
http://www.yf-stone.cn/images/p14.jpg
I myself like the Bottocino Classico the best.
its has darker veins.
http://www.creative-habitats.com/creative05/gallery/botticino_classico.jpg

pdianne
03-01-2008, 01:10 AM
We've just been shopping for Botticino marble (awaiting the arrival of our order any day now...). There was a definite difference between the Italian marble and all the others. While it was significantly more pricey, we went with the Italian as it was the more refined, elegant look we wanted.

Ozarkite
03-01-2008, 06:37 AM
Thank you for your replies. My customer had purchased tile for the job. I have not seen enough different grades of marble to really tell if this was good or not. What I have used was always very nice, and did not want to insult or upset my customer by saying it looked like seconds or worse.

I did discuss with her what would be involved with getting it to look as good as I could...using bad ones for cut pieces, doing away with imperfections, etc.

Just curious as to what others thought...

Thanks again,
Carroll

MICK1
03-01-2008, 07:47 AM
As Lazarus said the Chinese had cash in on the stone market producing way below the quality that Italy, Spain ,etc offer. They are in my point of view do more damage than good by offering products disguised under Italian names and cheap prices, they do not have the technology or the skills to produce decent materials even if they import the blocks from Italy, Spain etc.


Mick

ccarlisle
03-01-2008, 08:59 AM
Not typical of the tile as it comes from a reputable stone dealer, which to me is at least half the buying decision (not just price). May or may not be from HD but no matter where from, caveat emptor...

Ozarkite
03-01-2008, 10:08 AM
Appreciate comments.


Dumb question of the hour:

Do the Chinese (and others) import the marble, or do they have marble quarries, and then sell it under established pattern names?

Hard to believe they could import and then produce tile, and then ship, etc., and still make a profit...especially selling cheaply...sort of.

Strange.

Carroll

Ozarkite
03-01-2008, 10:16 AM
Pam-

....the more refined, elegant look we wanted


Pam, that was almost exactly what my customer was expecting. Major disappointment when we examined the tiles out of the box. Evidently, the salesperson led her to believe it was the best.

Customer is having conversation with salesperson as of yesterday afternoon, also needing more tile, as the estimated coverage was a little short.

I feel to blame on most of this, as I am usually in early on buying descisions for projects, I just was delayed on this job and didn't get in on it.

I will let everyone know how it turns out Monday evening.

Carroll

Ozarkite
03-01-2008, 10:23 AM
Brian-

Thanks for the pics. Nice ones.

The tile customer purchased looks similar to the Botticino Beige, except with very well defined veins (almost open cracks)

Carroll

Stonehenge
03-01-2008, 10:25 AM
Natural Stone is transported in 6' x 10' x 6' blocks all over the world.

Slabs can also processed in there country of origin.

For example the Crema Marfil quarry is located in the Valencia area of Spain, they process materials nearby, however a large amount of rough blocks are also transported to several countries.

Ozarkite
03-01-2008, 10:33 AM
Stonehenge-

That is interesting. You would think the transportation cost would be pretty high, but then I guess if you ship a LOT of it...it pays to get it.

Kinda like Japan likes any old growth wood they can get, or any other premium wood. So we sell it to them. Course, for that matter, we will sell almost anything to anybody...

Carroll

MICK1
03-01-2008, 10:37 AM
Including Italy, Turkey and CHINA.The Chinese also have an "habit" to mislead and use Italian names as the material was actually originated and processed over there (China).There is two type of Botticino that comes from Italy wich are Botticino Classico and Botticino Fiorito, so is very important to check the boxes and read if actually the material is made in Italy.


Mick

Stonehenge
03-01-2008, 10:47 AM
Hi Carroll

My name is Michael by the way, I keep forgetting to sign my posts.

The best Botticino out there rarely comes to the USA, the best stone stays in Italy or gets transported to the middle east where they can afford this premium version. I have re-polished the classico, semi classico and Fiorito versions and have only personally seen the premium stone in churches where it was installed over 80 years ago.

Sincerely,

Michael

Ozarkite
03-01-2008, 10:54 AM
Michael-

I made the mistake of looking at your website.

How long has the Tuscan system been around?

Do I get in trouble asking business questions here?

MICK1
03-01-2008, 10:58 AM
The TLS tuscan leveling system has been in full production for the last 6 months.

Mick

Ozarkite
03-01-2008, 11:24 AM
How soon could you ship?

MICK1
03-01-2008, 11:43 AM
If you order today, it will go out by monday.

Mick

Ozarkite
03-01-2008, 11:46 AM
It is a done deal, then.

I will let you know how it works out.

MICK1
03-01-2008, 12:07 PM
thanks, If you have any questions please do not hesitate to contact me at 319 670 0003.(7 days a week)

Thanks,

Mick

justin savage
03-01-2008, 05:28 PM
We have been doing a house with 4 bathrooms all of them with marble from home depot. The stuff is terrible , full of fillers than dont match , many pieces are glued together , and lots of chips. You have to add to your price for this crap because it takes longer - it falls apart in your hand , what a pain. justin

MICK1
03-01-2008, 06:02 PM
I agree with you, there is a misinformation out there to customer that they think they get a bargain by buy chinese stone, the truth is actually it cost them more money in the end, is the walmart mentality. I just finished a job with 3600 sq.ft of Chinese "marble" and at the end of the job i swear that I will NOT lay chinese stone for the same price that I lay stone that comes from the EU.
If they could achieve the same quality as Italy and such for inferior prices I would be all for that, the only thing that they achieve is to sell inferior quality
at inferior prices.At the same time there is a lot of customer that couldnt never afford to do their kitchen or bathroom in stone unless they buy Chinese materials so I guess the coin as two sides of it, I'm not tryng to offend anybody , just giving my opinion.

Mick

Mick

JTG
03-01-2008, 06:08 PM
As Justin said the HD marble is just BAD. I carry a piece in my pocket to show folks. It is so so soft inside. doesn't even look like stone.
And break! Just look at if funny or run it thru the saw and watch it crack. Better figure about 20% overage for tile failure.
Just say no to HD marble IMO.
Good Luck
JTG

Ozarkite
03-02-2008, 05:45 PM
Really appreciate all good comments on the Chinese tile. The more that I know, I can pass good, solid information to my customer, and future customers.

At least JTG has found a use for the stuff! I wonder if I need a license to carry concealed?

Tomorrow morning the homeowner and I will come to some decisions about the tile...and with everyone's input, I will be able to help realize the look and lasting job desired.