Liquid membrane shower pan system. [Archive] - Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile

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Dale Watnee
04-29-2002, 06:16 PM
2LiveCrew:
I have been working late at night in scary places and have come up with a method for using the liquid waterproof membranes in place of the traditional sheet type liners, PVC or CPE.
I have been using all the big guys products and found some to be better than others. The method is fast, reliable and eliminates the need for cutting, folding and caulking the system together.
Going throw the tin cup down and see you kicks it around.
dale

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Bud Cline
04-29-2002, 06:18 PM
Your a riot Watnee.

Suppose this is the last you'll have to say on the subject, huh?

John Bridge
04-29-2002, 06:39 PM
Well, I'm interested. I will move this to the deep end, though.

Rob Z
04-29-2002, 06:57 PM
My first night back on the job, and THIS is the second thing I see? :D

Dale, get your flak jacket on, buddy! :D Incoming any minute...

flatfloor
04-29-2002, 08:05 PM
Well, at least it's not in the Mudbox. Have at it mates! :D

Rob Z
04-29-2002, 09:11 PM
Hey Dale

On second thought...just how scary can it be in the retirement capital of NC ? I'm the one that (not anymore)does night jobs in lovely, safe, Wash DC. You're from around here...you know what I mean :D .

John Bridge
05-01-2002, 06:25 PM
Well, we've discussed the advantages for quite a while now. I think most people agree it's much better to keep water out of the setting bed if that's possible. The only questions (and argument) have revolved around how to do it.

I am thoroughly sold on the Schluter system. They need to come out with an inside corner just to put minds at ease, but the system is dyn-o-mite.

The only thing holding other systems back is the lack of a suitable drain, in my estimation. It's only a matter of time, guys.

Don your protective gear and hold forth, Dale. [Remember to keep low and hug the treeline.] :D

Bud Cline
05-01-2002, 06:33 PM
He ain't comin' back with anything useable.................

Fletch
05-02-2002, 07:05 AM
What is wrong with the schluter drain?
I was considering using this system for my steam shower.
I like the square drain.
Will this system work for a laundry room floor drain?

flatfloor
05-02-2002, 07:47 AM
With all the technology available today why couldn't someome come up with a paint on or roll on waterproof liquid membrane?

william hendry
05-02-2002, 01:02 PM
Isn't that what Laticrete 9235 is?

Bud Cline
05-02-2002, 01:02 PM
Fletch,

I can tell you where to find a universal square top to fit any shower floor drain it will screw right in, or even better I can put you onto just the square strainer cover that fits the drain cup. The same two little screws hold the square that holds the round.

The Schluter thingy is nice too but you don't have to go that route to get a square drain.

flatfloor
05-02-2002, 01:14 PM
Right you are Bill, sorry about that.

william hendry
05-02-2002, 01:30 PM
Whew! Too many products to keep up with these days; I always feel like I'm missing something.

John Bridge
05-02-2002, 06:01 PM
The Laticrete stuff is one of the things Dale has been using (and Bud, too).

The Schluter drain is the only one available that allows you to connect to the membrane ON TOP of the mud bed. Every other drain available connects to the membrane above the pre-slope. With Schluter you don't have a pre-slope. You float the entire mud bed to the Schluter drain flange and then apply the matting (membrane) to the surface. The tile adheres to the matting with thin set.

Problemo: The Schluter drain kit costs well over a hundred bucks.

Fletch
05-02-2002, 06:10 PM
I read that they are not code. Is this true? Why? Am I better off with the preslope and trowel on as for extra protection?
I like the strainer feature and clean look of the schluter
System. Bud mentioned a couple other drains. What drain would come close to the schluter?

John Bridge
05-02-2002, 06:15 PM
The Schluter shower floor is not code. They are working now to get it approved, but it's a lengthy process.

I would not let that deter me, though. It's an excellent system.

Fletch
05-02-2002, 06:24 PM
Thanks john
The inspectors in our area probably would not even notice.
I am leaning towards that system. This will be my first mud shower. Sould I coat the walls as well as the floor? I know you dont think steam showers need it on the walls. I watched the schluter video and they did everything, I know they are selling product this way. The walls will be cbu unless you are coming to new york in august. Should I poly first then cbu? I am thinking of extending the radiant heat into the walls. I guess I should check with schluter for compability issues. Off topic, do you have any light recommendations for a steam shower? I would like a tightly sealed unit.

Dale Watnee
05-02-2002, 08:35 PM
2LiveCrew:
I have been working nights as well.
A quick read of the responses seems to lead me to believe everyone thinks I am talking about the liquid membrane on top of the mortar bed.
I have been using the membrane over the ProForm preslopes and laying a stucco netting into it while still plastic. The stucco netting creates the guage for 40 mil thickness. Then I float the dry pack mortar bed and tile.
The liquid membrane is painted on slopes and interfacing walls and then I press the wedi panels into it on the walls while still wet. I next repaint the wall/pan slope interfaces.
You just run the netting across the drain and paint down onto the drain flange.
Next day I cut the netting out, set the top ring and adjust the strainer for finished height.
I would tell you some of the other stuff I have developed using ProForm products that completely eliminate the mortar bed, but who knows what nefarious characters are lurking about.
I always wear body armour on this site.
Incoming, I hope the trench is deep enough.
dale

Bud Cline
05-02-2002, 08:46 PM
$79 here but still too much.

chip
05-10-2002, 04:45 AM
I'll bet no one ever though of this one before!!!

It is amazing how the inventive mind works, membrane pan liners, curbs?, niches?, slopes?, shower pans? What next thin set?

The curb is remarkably similar to the pipe cover used in Europe.

chip

Scooter
05-10-2002, 10:53 AM
I am not sure Kedi would pass here, either. Our inspectors like to see a pre-slope and a pan. But inspectors are hit and miss.

I've seen idiots pass torch on roofing over a flat subfloor, and the same guy bitch about no pressure valve. Sheesh!

I would think if the inspection was made before tiling, and the drain is stopped up and holds water, it would probably be passed, but it is not in the LA Building Code as being one of the designated types of pans.

Does people claim that Kerdi has a Plasticizer issue? Mind you I think that whole docu-drama is bull, but WWDMD?

You've heard of WWJD (what would Jesus do?), so WWMD (what would Michael do?)

John Bridge
05-10-2002, 03:59 PM
Scooter,

I don't think Kerdi has a problem, but it's been around less than two decades, so it hasn't exactly withstood the test of time, has it? :D

I missed a question from Fletch a week or so ago. Sorry.

Schluter does indeed want to sell product, but they recommend the Kerdi go up the walls as far as the shower head to eliminate the possiblilty of water getting behind the the pan liner, which is, of course, on top of the mud. It's my experience that water penetrates the bottom third of shower walls. I would therefore run the Kerdi up about half way.

Dale Watnee
05-11-2002, 10:19 AM
Crew:
No need to reinvent the wheel. Thinsets are almost a dime a dozen these days, if fact, they are just commondities like backerboards.
The really interesting thing about inventive minds is that they look over the edges of things and come back to tell the sheep whats possible.
Chip, you need to keep focused on the singular fact that to innovate is not to reform. And secondly, and probably more importantly, as you may learned, the world more often rewards the appearance of merit than merit itself.
Just to keep this tread on subject and to keep things interesting, I use WP-6000, as recommended by your company Chip.
Think of that the sigthed leading the blind, into the forest they can't see because of the trees.
Don't forget the water test.
Know it, because I do it and then tell others.
dale