Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile

Welcome to John Bridge / Tile Your World, the friendliest DIY Forum on the Internet


Advertiser Directory
JohnBridge.com Home
Buy John Bridge's Books   Buy a TYW Shirt

Go Back   Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile > Tile & Stone Forums > Tile Forum/Advice Board

Sponsors


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-03-2008, 03:44 PM   #1
Willl
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: ND
Posts: 178
underlayment primer

Hello, I have an installation where I have tiles that have been epoxied on there back side. I was going to use mapeis Ultraflex 3 which is a polymer modified thinset to install the tiles but the thinset doesn't really adhere as well as I would've like it to to the epoxy. It does adhere some but I would like a better adhesion. I was thinking about first painting on mapeprime 1k (underlayment primer) on the back of the tiles before I installed them with the polymer modified thinset. Those underlayment primers are supposed to provide good adhesion to nonporous surfaces like adhesions before you install the self-leveling underlayment. Perhaps it will also work with a polymer modified thinset. Thanks
Willl is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 09-03-2008, 04:19 PM   #2
Davestone
Florida Tile & Stone Man
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Naples Fl.
Posts: 23,059
Don't know about that Will, read this...http://www.laticrete.com/portals/0/tds/tds150.pdf
__________________
Dave



http://Davestonestile.com
Davestone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2008, 04:58 PM   #3
Willl
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: ND
Posts: 178
Hi there davestone, I should've mentioned in my previous post but still wanted your opinion on it that I did do a test with mapeprime 1k and the adhesion does seem to be swell. I wouldn't say the adhesion was excellent but would probably use the word "good". I used a brush to apply mapeprime 1k to that back of the tile, wait an hour, then I applied the polymer modified thinset. The bond does seem to be OK. Still not sure that this is the best method or approach to this problem of mine. I like working with polymer modified thinset more than with epoxy thinset so would like to stick with it if I can. Clearly if this method is exceptable then I will have to paint each tile with primer an hour to 24 hours before I apply it to the substrate. Probably easier than working with epoxy though. Thanks
Willl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2008, 05:10 PM   #4
jadnashua
Veteran DIYer- Schluterville Graduate
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Nashua, NH
Posts: 8,979
Have you tried back buttering the tile by burning in a thin layer of thinset? I know that with some porcelain tiles, it makes a huge difference in the initial tack when setting the tile.
__________________
Jim DeBruycker
Not a pro, multiple Schluter Workshops (Schluterville and 2013 and 2014 at Schluter Headquarters), Mapei Training 2014, and Longtime Forum Participant.
jadnashua is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 09:44 AM   #5
MudGuy
Pass the Mud
 
MudGuy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: New Mexico
Posts: 467
Quote:
Originally Posted by Willl
I was thinking about first painting on mapeprime 1k (underlayment primer) on the back of the tiles before I installed them with the polymer modified thinset.
That method not only sounds like a pain in the arse but will probably not get a nod from the folks at Mapei.

If you're looking for a better bond, and you like the Mapei products, give Mapei Kerabond/Keralastic a whirl. Tenacious bond that stuff.
__________________
Jonathan
MudGuy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 09:59 AM   #6
Willl
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: ND
Posts: 178
The folks at mapei like all others say to only use epoxy for epoxy. While some professionals say to burn it on while still others say this and still others say something else. Doesn't seem like there is a universal way to handle this problem so I think I am going to just do it my own way. I have already tried jadnashuas way which is to burn on a thin layer and as I said in the first post it does bond but somewhat mediocre in my opinion. If you scrap the thinset on the side it tends to want it flak off which is a no no to me. If I use the mapeprime 1k the bond is good. It doesn't flake off but forms a much better bond. Despite mapeis saying not to do this in the instructions for the mapeprime it does say that it can bond to old adhesive. Well I tried and tested it on this adhesive and it does bond so what is the problem.
Willl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 10:23 AM   #7
MudGuy
Pass the Mud
 
MudGuy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: New Mexico
Posts: 467
Quote:
Originally Posted by Willl
The folks at mapei like all others say to only use epoxy for epoxy.
That's great and I'd listen to them. But did you ask them about your proposed method of painting the backs of each individual tile with 1K?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willl
Despite mapeis saying not to do this in the instructions for the mapeprime it does say that it can bond to old adhesive.
You're right and it also will bond to ceramic tile but does it make any recommendations for epoxy, providing that is in fact what you're working with?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willl
so what is the problem
No problem, just trying to make your life easier with a product recommendation. If your tile is in fact epoxied on the back, then perhaps one should go with Mapei's recommendation or that of Davestone's link to Laticrete. If you're having success with your method, I can't understand why Kerabond/Keralastic wouldn't do the trick and save a lot of aggravation with your intended method.

__________________
Jonathan
MudGuy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 10:57 AM   #8
Willl
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: ND
Posts: 178
To be honest I am not to sure what kind of adhesive it is. Epoxy, polyester whatever. Those manufacturers use alot of different things.

Ok but sense my last post I did some thinking and testing and placing a 24 grit belt on a belt sander and seeing how long it took me it only took me 10 seconds to scarify one tile. Not bad. I think I will go with that. Thanks
Willl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-04-2008, 07:24 PM   #9
jadnashua
Veteran DIYer- Schluterville Graduate
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Nashua, NH
Posts: 8,979
I think you may not understand my thoughts on backbuttering...you do it while setting the tile, not putting a layer on and letting it dry first. I've found that it takes a fair amount of pressure to push a layer of thinset into the pores. Just a once over to get a coat on doesn't cut it. But, if you press well, while wet, the only way to get it off is to scrub it off. You can't scrap it off. I'd guess something like Redgard would make a decent bond and if it works, hey why not.
__________________
Jim DeBruycker
Not a pro, multiple Schluter Workshops (Schluterville and 2013 and 2014 at Schluter Headquarters), Mapei Training 2014, and Longtime Forum Participant.
jadnashua is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Buy John's New Book!   Tile Your World Online Store   Contractors Direct Tile Tool Store   Stonetooling.com   Tile-Assn.com


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:33 PM.


Sponsors

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2014 John Bridge & Associates, LLC