Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile

Welcome to John Bridge / Tile Your World, the friendliest DIY Forum on the Internet


Advertiser Directory
JohnBridge.com Home
Buy John Bridge's Books   Buy a TYW Shirt

Go Back   Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile > Tile & Stone Forums > Tile Forum/Advice Board

Sponsors


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 04-07-2008, 08:25 AM   #1
BobL27
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 7
Smile re-tiling over wall tile

Hi, I am new here and I tried searching for existing threads on this but had no success. So I apologize if I am asking someithing that mave have been answered (many) times before.

I am going to install new wall tile in my kitchen. The walls are already tiled, and the tile is in excellent condition. I installed the existing tiles 20 years ago and my wife is tired of it already. The tile was adhered to the sheetrock walls with mastic. The existing tiles are glazed. I do not have to worry about the added thickness against door casings or any exposed ends.

Is there a mastic that is suitable to bond new ceramic wall tiles over existing glazed tiles? Is is necessary to sand down the glaze to give the mastic more "tooth"?

Thanks for your help on this.
Bob
BobL27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 04-07-2008, 09:18 AM   #2
ddmoit
Veteran DIYer -- Schluterville Graduate
 
ddmoit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: SE Tennessee
Posts: 8,948
Hi Bob, and welcome to the forum.

You can tile over your existing tile, bearing in mind that your new tile installation is bonded only as well as your old installation. It sounds like you are confident in the existing installation.

I don't think I would use mastic this time around. I think a modified thinset that you have to mix with water, or some additive would be best.

You will have to thoroughly clean your existing tiles to remove any grease, cleaner residue, etc. You will also need to scuff up the glaze to provide a suitable bonding surface.

Good luck!
__________________
Dan - a DIYer in SE Tennessee
ddmoit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2008, 10:18 AM   #3
BobL27
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 7
retiling


Hi Dan,

Thanks for the fast reply. Yes, the existing tile and substrate sheetrock are in excellent, stable condition.

Is the modified thinset the better choice always, or in my case, will it provide a better bond to the sanded down glazed tiles than mastic will?

Thanks Again,

Bob
BobL27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2008, 10:59 AM   #4
ddmoit
Veteran DIYer -- Schluterville Graduate
 
ddmoit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: SE Tennessee
Posts: 8,948
I wouldn't say that unmodified thinset is always the best choice.

You'll find that mastic isn't too popular around here, but it does have it's place. Using it to adhere smaller ceramic tile to drywall in a dry area like your back splash was a good choice.

I should have asked you what your new tiles are. Ceramic? Porcelain? If they are natural stone, or much larger than 6" on a side, I would definitely stay away from mastic. It's possible that a mastic might work again, but I know that a decent modified thinset will (even a decent unmodified would likely be sufficient).
__________________
Dan - a DIYer in SE Tennessee
ddmoit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2008, 12:38 PM   #5
BobL27
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 7
Smile

Hi Dan,

The new tiles haven't been selected yet, but they will be 6x6 inch porcelain stain resistant tiles. We saw them at the tile store for about 9 bucks a square foot, where the tumbled stone was at 37 bucks a square foot. I don't want to get a new mortgage on my house, so I guess I will not be using real tumbled stone, but just the "look-like". Then again, I haven't been to the big box stores to see what they have to offer (usually not much).

Bob
BobL27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-18-2008, 10:50 AM   #6
BobL27
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 7
Oh well, we changed our minds about going over the old tile. My wife had nighmares about the new tiles falling off, so I will be ripping it all out and putting up new sheetrock. So now, is modified thinset what I should be using?
And the new sheetrock: does it need to be primed first, or not?

Another question: the tiles that HD and Lowes sell, are they generally decent quality stuff, or substandard junk?

Thanks,

Bob
BobL27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-18-2008, 10:57 AM   #7
ddmoit
Veteran DIYer -- Schluterville Graduate
 
ddmoit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: SE Tennessee
Posts: 8,948
Hi Bob,

It's best to tile right over untreated drywall; don't prime or paint it.

Tape any joints with alkali-resistant mesh tape as you are tiling, and yes, use a good unmodified. VersaBond from HD is a fine choice.

Generally, the pros here believe that better tiles can be had at tile stores over the big boxes. You can get some good stuff from the big boxes though.
__________________
Dan - a DIYer in SE Tennessee
ddmoit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2008, 05:41 AM   #8
BobL27
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 7
Hi Dan,

Well, I gutted the walls yesterday. At 65 years old, the sheetrock and tile sections I ripped off the walls got pretty heavy in the garbage cans I put them in and dragged outside At least that part is done

When I tape the joints as you said above and thinset over them, do I fill in the tapered sheetrock joints with the thinset the same as I would with spackle if they were just going to be painted or wallpapered?

Thanks,

Bob
BobL27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2008, 09:29 AM   #9
ddmoit
Veteran DIYer -- Schluterville Graduate
 
ddmoit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: SE Tennessee
Posts: 8,948
Yes.

If it becomes too challenging to even out that taper as you are tiling, you can opt to tape and level those joints as a separate step before you tile. This might make sense if your tiles are small, and don't fully span the tapered section.

It's OK to apply thinset as thick as 1/4" at a time, so that tapered joint is well within limits.
__________________
Dan - a DIYer in SE Tennessee
ddmoit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-2008, 08:07 AM   #10
BobL27
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 7
Waste allowance



I have a quick question today.

If I install the tiles at a 45 degree angle instead of horizontally, how much extra waste is involved? Is there a rule of thumb on how much extra tile to buy when installing at an angle?

Thanks, and Happy Memorial day weekend.

Bob
BobL27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-2008, 08:16 AM   #11
John Bridge
Mudmeister
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 64,918
Send a message via AIM to John Bridge
Hi Bob,

VersaBond (Home Depot) is a modified mortar, but it's a good choice for your project.

If you fill in the recesses with thin set, make doubly sure you get them the way you want them. You won't be sanding the thin set. I would probably just tape the drywall with joint compound. Thin set will stick to it if there is no dust on the surface.

You'll get a little more waste with diagonals but not an appreciable amount. I don't think there's a ratio.
John Bridge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2008, 03:02 PM   #12
BobL27
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 7
Thumbs up Thanks!

Hi John,

Thanks for the quick reply. We had the Granite fabricator install the countertops the other day, so now when I find/make the time, I have to get going on the tile work. My wife is still trying to decide on some deco tile inserts and a patern for them over the sink. Not a whole lot of height over the granite at the sink area: about 17 inches from the granite surface to the bottom of the cabinet frame. 6 inch tiles diagonally is just a little over that.
I guess the height is pretty standard.

Anyhow, you have a great help forum here, and I would like to extend to you and your contributors here, my appreciation for it!
BobL27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Buy John's New Book!   Tile Your World Online Store   Contractors Direct Tile Tool Store   Stonetooling.com   Tile-Assn.com


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:21 PM.


Sponsors

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2014 John Bridge & Associates, LLC