Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile

Welcome to John Bridge / Tile Your World, the friendliest DIY Forum on the Internet


Advertiser Directory
JohnBridge.com Home
Buy John Bridge's Books

Go Back   Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile > Tile & Stone Forums > The Mud Box

Sponsors


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 11-06-2017, 11:33 AM   #31
Steve in Denver
Registered User
 
Steve in Denver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Mile High City
Posts: 886
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kman
could one dispense with the joist hangers and just toenail the blocking in with 3" screws?
That's what I would have done, too, but I ain't so good with toe nailing. I can never seem to get it to all work out well. Either I split the wood, or end up with a bit of a gap between the blocking and the subfloor...

Important thing (to me) is that I'm done, and it worked out well.

I met with the flooring guys this morning, and they were thrilled with all of the prep I did. (fastening the floors, sanding all the ridges / bumps, and the blocking) I think they were shocked, actually. At one point the lead guy said "This is perfect." Then after a pause, "More than perfect."

Hopefully that translates into a perfect finished floor.
__________________
Steve
Steve in Denver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2017, 02:10 PM   #32
wwhitney
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Berkeley, CA
Posts: 757
Nice job!

If you're in a situation where you'd like to toe nail/toe screw and you're having trouble, then one thing you can do is drill a pilot hole. I like to drill it backwards, start drilling where I want the fastener to come out and drill towards where I'm going to start the fastener. Then I can start the fasteners in the pilot holes before final positioning of the piece.

Obviously that takes longer, but it still may be competitive with joist hangers.

Cheers, Wayne
__________________
Wayne
wwhitney is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2017, 05:39 PM   #33
Kman
Moderator
 
Kman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: NW Arkansas, Ozark Mountains
Posts: 8,858
More than perfect?

You must have given it 110%.
__________________
Kevin

The top ten reasons to procrastinate:

1.
Kman is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2017, 09:26 PM   #34
Steve in Denver
Registered User
 
Steve in Denver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Mile High City
Posts: 886
I stopped by the house to inspect progress..looked good at a glance, but when I checked out the staples, ingot concerned. Please check the attached images and tell me what you think.

Also if anyone knows of a "TCNA manual for hardwood flooring" any other standards that I can refer to, that would be helpful.

Thanks

Steve

BTW, these were some of the worst, but by no means the only issues with staples. Of the 33 staples I was able to see, 26 had some degree of cracking or splitting.
Attached Images
    
__________________
Steve
Steve in Denver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2017, 10:04 PM   #35
lati_cz
michal
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: sunnyvale, ca
Posts: 1,856
Steve, I am not expert. I used to work close with decent hardwood floor guy, he told me the fastener shouldn't drive any further than the pin that drives it. I'd say the pressure is to high.
https://www.nwfa.org
__________________
Michal
lati_cz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2017, 11:42 PM   #36
Steve in Denver
Registered User
 
Steve in Denver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Mile High City
Posts: 886
Thanks, Michal.

I will look at the website you linked and see if I can find some sort of industry guidelines - hopefully I won't need them, but I may have to make a case with my flooring contractor.

It's damn frustrating to do all of the prep work and then hire out the "real work" to pros only to find out that I probably would have done a better job myself.

Again, thanks to everyone for all the input.
__________________
Steve
Steve in Denver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-07-2017, 03:11 AM   #37
Kman
Moderator
 
Kman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: NW Arkansas, Ozark Mountains
Posts: 8,858
Steve, there are some real hardwood flooring experts here that can answer any questions and address any concerns you may have.

Typically the joints fit pretty tight, but the installer's should be filling everything before sanding.
__________________
Kevin

The top ten reasons to procrastinate:

1.
Kman is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-07-2017, 12:54 PM   #38
Steve in Denver
Registered User
 
Steve in Denver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Mile High City
Posts: 886
Thanks, Kman.

I started a thread this morning and have already gotten several responses.

I met with the flooring company rep this morning, and he told me the split tongues were not a big deal and that they would just adjust the compressor to a lower setting. Eventually, after some back and forth, he agreed to rip it up and get a different crew in there. He still insisted that I was over reacting and that the floor would have been fine as it was. When I pointed out that the manufacturers instructions explicitly said to not allow the fastener to crack/split the tongues I got the "I have been. Doing this for 25 yearS" bit....

In the end I don't think there is a level.of trust / good working relationship, so I think k I'm going to pull the plug on these guys.
__________________
Steve
Steve in Denver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-15-2017, 05:05 PM   #39
Steve in Denver
Registered User
 
Steve in Denver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Mile High City
Posts: 886
Update and question. (It's not good)

I met with the job supervisor last Monday to express my concerns. He looked at the floor, said I was over-reacting, and that nothing was wrong with it. I pushed back, referring to the NOFMA / NWFA installation manual, and things got a little heated. He continued to insist the floor was fine, and at some point I told him that I wanted to rip it up and start over, with a different crew. After telling me he wasn't even sure he wanted to work with me anymore, he made a phone call to the office and came back and said they would rip it up and start over. I asked this time to get his "best crew" - he told me they are all good, and the new crew isn't going to be any better or any worse than the first crew. (continued to maintain the first crew had done good work in spite of numerous issues)

At this point the relationship was at a bad spot. I could no longer trust his judgment in supervising the installation.

I sent an email to the office with multiple pictures showing various problems, and detailed my problems with the job manager. I told them I wanted to mutually cancel the contract and be issued a full refund. They agreed that there were problems and that they would send out a new crew to finish. They were not willing to issue a refund, and insisted they would be able to do it right with a different and more experienced crew. They also pointed out the contract "right to remedy" clause.

Without going into the details point by point, I told them that I want out, and the issue is bigger than any particular problem on the installation...I can no longer trust them, I no longer want to work with them. As far as I'm concerned they aren't able to remedy the main problem, which is them. (In the process of ripping up the floor I found at least 2 other problems with the installation - these problems were clearly overlooked the first time, and I would have had no way of knowing without ripping the floor up)

So, that's that.

I understand their right to remedy, but I am so dissatisfied with them that I don't want them doing the work even if it is done perfectly. I want out. They don't want to let me out, claiming lost profit and restocking fees (I happen to know the restocking fees are not true). I have offered to buy the material from them to avoid the restocking fees, etc. I haven't heard back from them yet, but it is possible that they will continue to hold their position (I think they are being unreasonable, but of course I do)...Assuming we are at an impasse what are my options?

BBB dispute
Charge back on the credit card
Insist on having a certified wood flooring inspector sign off on every phase of the job
something else?
__________________
Steve

Last edited by Steve in Denver; 11-15-2017 at 05:18 PM.
Steve in Denver is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Stonetooling.com   Tile-Assn.com   National Gypsum Permabase


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
granite tile and 3/4 hardwood floor install nyctilerookie Tile Forum/Advice Board 82 09-07-2013 11:14 PM
Hardwood floor install question TonyB Tile Forum/Advice Board 1 08-30-2011 12:02 PM
Hardwood Floor questions harleysilo The Mud Box 6 03-16-2011 08:16 AM
Kitchen Tile project - some questions (un-flat floor & transition to hardwood) SmallSea Tile Forum/Advice Board 4 05-21-2007 11:43 AM
Heated Floor Install Questions GFT Tile Forum/Advice Board 9 11-22-2002 04:27 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:21 AM.


Sponsors

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2014 John Bridge & Associates, LLC