12" x 24" Tile in shower [Archive] - Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile

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FlynHokie
05-11-2009, 09:19 PM
Hello all.

I'm putting up 12x24 porcelian tile in our shower. (NEOSTILE 12 X 24 - Ekru)

Is there anything I should be concerned about when tiling a wall with such large tile? I've done plenty of floor tiling with tile as large, but never done a wall tile before.

Frame is inplace. Studs, 1/4"fur strips, 6mil membrane, 1/4" Hardiboard. Ready for tiling...

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Tool Guy - Kg
05-11-2009, 09:26 PM
If that 1/4" Hardi is the only thing spanning from stud to stud, I would be nervous. :)

sandbagger
05-11-2009, 09:40 PM
what Tonto said. And better make sure them walls is REALLY flat! :nod:

Jaz
05-11-2009, 09:43 PM
Flyn,

You do NOT use 1/4" backer on walls. I agree, hope the walls are flat. How are you doing the floor?

Jaz

muskymike
05-11-2009, 10:15 PM
Hi Flyn, I would take out the 1/4" Hardi and use 1/2". :)

FlynHokie
05-12-2009, 04:38 AM
We'll that sucks :-(

I was wondering if it was sturdy enough - it does flex quite a bit. Hardi website says 1/4" is suitable for walls, as long as screwed in every 8" min, and studs no greater than 16" apart- so I figured it was alright when I purchased it.

I used the 1/4" furring and the 1/4" hardi so the backerboard would end up flush with the drywall. Plus the 1/4" furring would allow for the 1/4" hardi to hang over the shower flange. The 1/2" is not flush with drywall - but slightly off, and wouldn't hang over the flange properly, unless I shaved 1/4" x 1/4" section off the bottom, which I don't know how to do.

Easy enough to rip the 1/4" down, and only about a $70 mistake, no biggie. Hopefully can use on the floor in other bathroom.

How do you suggest I ge the 1/2" hardi flush with drywall, and over flange?

Thanks for the heads up y'all. Saved me tons of trouble down the road, I'm sure!

As for the floor, same way I did my other floors in the house. I have a sturdy subfloor (replaced the 'sawdust' board underneath with plywood), about 1.25" thick. 1/4" Hardi backer set in thinset, and screwed every 8 inches. That covers the span of the floor. Americh shower pan sits on that subfloor. Once tiling shower is done, drywall is done, will tile floor, install toilet flange & toilet, cabinet/sink, and project is done (hopefully).

bbcamp
05-12-2009, 05:04 AM
Just stop the 1/2" backerboard 1/8" above the top of the flange, then let the tile over hang the flange and stop about 1/8" above the deck.

ceramictec
05-12-2009, 06:48 AM
not looking at the Hardi data sheet for a while but if I can remember it says " 1/4" suitable for floors & countertops".

I don't remember it saying anything about ok for wall.
but then again I wouldn't consider 1/4 on the wall.

FlynHokie
05-12-2009, 04:37 PM
So, it's ok for the backer board not to go over the flange? The waterproof membrane will still go over it....

And, just the 1/2" backer over studs should be sturdy enough?

Thanks again all! Off to Lowes to pick up the 1/2".

FYI:
Hardi Website says:
"HardieBacker® 1/4" Cement Board, with EZ Grid® Technology, for floors and countertops is America's best selling 1/4" board. It's the solution you can trust for your wet area floors, walls, ceilings, and countertops."

I guess the last sentence was for hardibacker in general, and the first was for 1/4", stating floors and countertops. It was the only one that would get me the dimensions I needed for lining up walls, and I saw the wall part, so assumed it was ok.

And we all know what assuming does...

FlynHokie
05-12-2009, 06:48 PM
Just picked up the 1/2" board - WOW, what a huge difference in rigidness. This will be a whole lot more stiff of a wall.

justin2006
05-12-2009, 08:13 PM
I'm not a pro, and I'm not suggesting you keep the 1/4" hardibacker, but below is one of the Q/A from the Hardibacker website.

Q. Can HardieBacker 1/4'' board be used in a shower wall application? Is a vapor barrier required?

A: Yes, HardieBacker 1/4'' cement board may be used in a shower. However, we recommend HardieBacker 500 if you need to make a smooth transition to drywall. The board must be mechanically fastened every 8'' on center to the wood or metal studs spaced a maximum of 16'' on center. A vapor barrier is needed if required by local building codes.

http://www.jameshardie.com/homeowner/products_backerboard_quarterInch.shtml?openTab=jsnavLink0#15

(( Need to click on "View FAQS" at the link above ))

FlynHokie
05-12-2009, 08:48 PM
That's where else I saw the reference saying it could be used!

But it really is too flexible as it is right now. 1/2" is purchased.

My only concern is not having it rest over the tub flange. A thought I had is to notch 1/4" out of the bottom of the backerboard, to let it rest over the flange, but, I don't see that gaining much, as the vapor barrier still sits over the flange.

Davestone
05-13-2009, 05:40 PM
You definitely should have it coming over the lip.

FlynHokie
05-13-2009, 08:42 PM
OK, I'm getting conflicting advice. What should I follow. Over flange, not over flange?

I've attached a picture to show what I understand my options as being.

As far as I'm aware, I need the hardi-backer board to end up flush (or close to flush) with the drywall. Otherwise, I need the backerboard to be 1/2" from the studs (hence, my original 1/4" fur strip, 1/4" hardi).

I think the best option is to shave off the back 1/4" of the bottom of 1/2" Hardi. that puts the hardi over the flange.

Thoughts?

bbcamp
05-14-2009, 04:26 AM
Option 1 will work with your big tiles.

FlynHokie
05-16-2009, 08:53 PM
Thanks Bob! I went with option #1. The 1/2" backer is soo much more sturdy than the 1/4" wall was. Should work out great.

Too keep my project in the same thread, I've got another question-

Came up with a question when laying tile (not setting) to see what it will look like. We are doing 12X24", laying it horizontally (long side horizontal) in a brick pattern. We are putting bull nose on the vertical edge of the shower.

Should the bull nose end line up with the outside of the showerpan threshold, or should it start at the threshold end? I'm worried that when we have the swinging glass door installed, that there will be an issue with the installers hooking up the hinge to a 3x12 bullnose piece, rather than the end of a 12x24 tile.

Thanks in advance!

Davestone
05-16-2009, 08:56 PM
I would extend the bullnose as far out as needed, it can even go past the edge of the pan and run down to the floor if needed.

FlynHokie
05-21-2009, 05:46 PM
Thanks Dave. We're going to go past the edge of the pan, down the front.

I am nearly finished with drywall in the bathroom, and will get to tiling this weekend (Hopefully).

From what I've read on tiling the walls, you want to keep each wall 'separate' from each other, and use a caulk in the corners. Is it OK to use grout in the corners?

dhagin
05-21-2009, 08:01 PM
Industry standard is to caulk changes of plane, corners, different materials, etc...

...however, many grout all. If the framing is secured tightly in the corners, and the structure doesn't 'move' too much, you may get some small cracks between the tile and the grout. Often hardly noticeable.

FlynHokie
06-03-2009, 09:07 PM
Here are some pictures of the work in progress. Tile is done, grouted. Need to caulk changes in planes, then install everything (shower, sink, fixtures, etc.)

FlynHokie
06-03-2009, 09:09 PM
More pics of finished tile job. no caulk yet. fixtures to come in a few weeks when I get back from travel.

muskymike
06-03-2009, 09:24 PM
Looks good Flyn. :)

FlynHokie
07-02-2009, 08:10 PM
Here is the shower door installed....Looks great! (the reflection of the light is funny looking - thelight is not in the shower...)

Oh, and pay no attention to the infant trainer toilet over the toilet flange. my 1 y/o was having fun pretending to have his own toilet in the new bathroom.

buggdog
07-04-2009, 08:53 AM
Nice work!!

I was thinking of using the same size tile in my shower and was wondering if there are any special tips/requirements for using tile of this size on a wall instead of a normal 12x12. Same methods or should a different method be used.

Cody21
07-04-2009, 02:21 PM
Not a pro here ... disclaimer ...

We're doing a similar thing - using 12x18" tiles in a "soldier" pattern on the 2 shower walls. The Tile guy at the store said to make sure the Versabond thinset we are planning to use is a bit thicker than what we'd put on the floor. I'll be watching this thread to see what others tell you. :think:

Brian in San Diego
07-04-2009, 02:40 PM
Lou,

If you want to ask questions for a project you are starting it would be good to start a thread of your own. Wouldn't want to muddle up this thread with different projects. It'd get way too confusing.

Brian

condo-owner
07-04-2009, 08:47 PM
Flyn
your shower/space looks almost exactly like my bathroom. see "condos show build".

your build looks good. can i ask = where did you get that door ? i like that.

buggdog
07-05-2009, 07:28 AM
Thanks Brian - I was just hoping to get the OPs opinion since he just installed the size tile I was looking at.

I will start a new thread though.

Thanks.

FlynHokie
07-05-2009, 02:38 PM
Here are the pre-final pictures. Just waiting on the replacement of a medicine cabinet that showed up the wrong color. Everything else is complete! Wooo hoo, what a long tedious job in my freetime, but well worth it. Looks so sharp!

condo-owner
07-05-2009, 03:29 PM
very nice indeed.

again, may i ask. where did you get that shower door ? and how do you like it ?

gueuzeman
07-05-2009, 07:17 PM
Looks great. Just sorry to see the little guy lost his toilet spot. :laugh2:

gueuze

FlynHokie
07-07-2009, 08:32 PM
Condo-owner, I got the door from a local installer (paid to have in installed), www.wantabetterview.com . The model is from Cardinal Shower Enclosures. I believe Basco also makes a similar unit. Your setup does indeed look very similar!

It's fun trying to plan a bathroom in such a small space. I was pleased with how the clear glass really opened up the room, and the large tile made it appear like a bigger room (thanks Interior Designer wife for picking things out!). I was worried about the lack of privacy, but then again, this is the master bath, and it has a door that locks...


Buggdog- I was surprised at how easy the 12x24 was to install. I ran into alot of issues in the beginning, just getting the layout right (Frame, 6mil poly, 1/2" hardibacker), but once that was done on the pan, the tile lay in real nice. Some of the comments I had were to be sure the wall is extremely flat. It did take some finessing to ensure the joints were smooth, and I ended up with a few corners that were about 1/32" off of the other tile - pretty good for an amature in my oppinion. Can't wait for my Brother in law, who's a pro, to visit and comment.

The Tile was from Happy-Floors tile, Neostile was the model, Ecru was the color.

I just bought the mortar from Home Depot (name escapes me at the moment, maybe Versabond), but it was the expensive bag (I used Laticrete previously on the kitchen/dining/office floor, but Lowes stopped selling it). I mixed it to standard consistancy, per directions on the bag.

If you do some research on this site, there were posts that I found that referenced large tile installations, and some of the experts on here had great input. I can't remember where the posts were back when I researched it.


Sorry it took so long to answer these questions. As always, this stuff is in my free time, which has been lacking this year. I'lll see if I can change my settings to alert me when PM's or new posts are submitted.

Thanks again to all the people on here for advice! It was invaluable.

FlynHokie.

condo-owner
07-07-2009, 08:42 PM
thanx, Flyn

have you used the shower yet ? does the door leak to the floor ? are there seals ?

FlynHokie
07-08-2009, 06:30 PM
I have used the shower, and it's great! The door does leak at the joint and hinge. We end up putting a washcloth on the floor at the joint to catch the small amount of water that drips there. you do have to avoid splashing the door, kepe the water between the wall and you, but it itsn't too bad. Worth it in my oppinion for the look.

condo-owner
07-08-2009, 07:20 PM
thanx, about what i expected. if i may ask. what did it cost ya ?

FlynHokie
07-08-2009, 07:39 PM
Whole project, 'bout $4500, all work but the door was mine.

the door, installed, $1200