F 18 Crashes

[Hamilton]

Send your prayers out to the families who lost loved ones today in San Diego.
I heard about this about 15 minutes after it happend. A good friend I am
currently working with got a call from his granite fabricator who was working
on the same street this jet went down in Miramar Ca. He said he heard a
loud screaming sound and then the biggest explosion he has ever heard in
his life. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,463725,00.html

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[HS345]

Send your prayers out to the families who lost loved ones today in San Diego.
I will.

Thanks for the heads up Jack, that's about 10 miles from my Mom's house, I didn't listen to the radio today, so I didn't hear about it on the news. :shake:

At least the pilot ejected safely at the last second, according to the story you posted.

Here's a story with a little more details. http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/metro/20081208-1938-bn08plane5.html

The pilot told several witnesses that the jet lost its first engine over the Pacific Ocean, and a decision was made to try to return to Miramar MCAS on one engine. The second engine failed when the plane was on final approach, he said.

[marinemom]

Same here - we'll keep them in our prayers.
(I sent my son a text to make sure he's ok, since he lives near Miramar. All is well.)
What I heard was the pilot ejected, but landed in a tree. He's at the naval hospital. 3 civilians weren't so lucky though.

[Hamilton]

Please do share better links and better info. I grabbed the first story I could
find online, honestly. I also heard on the radio the pilot had ejected safely. Thank you. Our prayers go out to the families who were victim to this random
event.

[ceramictec]

are you near this ?

A man walks past a home engulfed in flames in the University City neighborhood after a military jet crashed into homes in San Diego, California December 8, 2008. The FA-18D crashed on Monday into the neighborhood after the pilot ejected.

http://i36.tinypic.com/2z6f9kx.jpg

http://i33.tinypic.com/55rs5k.jpg

[HS345]

Please do share better links and better info.
Your story was fine amigo, I just decided to check the San Diego Union Tribune for a local angle. :tup2:

[ceramictec]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/military_jet_crash;_ylt=Aha.JKymDib4hD6UG31txqSs0NUE

there saying it was near Miramar, not in Miramar.

[HS345]

Brian, is that the pilot sitting on someone's front lawn?

[ceramictec]

is that the pilot sitting on someone's front lawn?yep

In this photo courtesy of Dawn Lyons, the pilot, foreground, sits on the lawn of a house in San Diego after ejecting safely from an F/A-18D that crashed in a densely populated neighborhood on Monday Dec. 8, 2008. A fighter jet returning to a Marine base after a training exercise crashed in flames in San Diego Monday, killing three people on the ground, leaving one missing and destroying two homes. The pilot of the F/A-18D Hornet jet ejected safely just before the crash around noon.
(AP Photo/Courtesy Dawn Lyons)

[marinemom]

http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/up/player/popup/?rn=3906861&cl=11012307&ch=4226713&src=news

[HS345]

Fourth body found in home at jet crash site. :(

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/metro/20081209-1634-bn09jetdown4.html

The body of a fourth family member killed in Monday's fiery jet crash – a 15-month-old girl – was found Tuesday near the entrance of the home where her mother, grandmother and infant sister also died.

[DIYourselfer]

Very sad indeed. The large fire and explosion indicates that there was fuel in the plane at the time of impact but after losing the second engine there is no hydraulics so the plane is uncontrollable, which is why the pilot had to eject instead of stearing it to an empty field.

[ceramictec]

from this one picture there is a fuel source for the fire, but it looks more to me like a natural gas line then jet fuel with how it burning.

[Sinic]

that poor pilot is going to have a lot to deal with in his mind for the rest of his life. :sick:
the photo speaks a million words,he looks devastated.
condolences to the victims.

[Bellsfloors]

Got second hand news from my Oldest nephew stationed in San Diego. He is one of the Marine Firefighters that was on the scene. He didn't say much about it other then asked if we had seen the news about it and how he had to give CPR to a couple of the victims and fight the fueled fed fire.

I feel for the victims, victims families, and also the pilot himself who will always undoubtably wonder if he could of prevented the catastrophe.

[HotinOKC]

Very sad indeed. The large fire and explosion indicates that there was fuel in the plane at the time of impact but after losing the second engine there is no hydraulics so the plane is uncontrollable, which is why the pilot had to eject instead of stearing it to an empty field.

Not all that true.

Even with the loss of both engines, the pilot will still have flight controls. Most fly by wire aircraft, like the F/A-18 usually have emergency power units (EPU) which supply power to the control surfaces. Also, the "stick" could be connected to cables, but can be assisted by the computers in flight control.

I was on a crash recovery team when I was stationed at Langley. We had to go into a crash site and recover the EPU tank (filled with hydrazine) and clean up any possible contamination. If I remember correctly, the F-16's had about 7-12 minutes of power, depending on how much they cycled the flight controls.

[ddmoit]

That's interesting, Mark. Like others, I presumed the pilot could no longer control the plane.

It's bothersome to me that the Navy knew this plane was in distress, to the point that they were not willing to attempt an aircraft carrier landing, but thought nothing of flying it over a residential area. Hindsight is 20-20, but ditching this craft in the water now seems like a more prudent option.

[sdaniels7114]

That would depend on the circumstances surrounding the loss of the first engine and what the pilot and anyone he conferred with knew about those circumstances. Losing one engine in a twin-engine airplane isn't that big a deal. Most airplanes regularly cruise at about 50% power and can hold altitude indefinitely with less.

In the civilian, propeller-driven world its standard practice to shut one engine down during training. The instructor will distract the student and switch off the fuel valve. A few seconds later it gets real quite on one side and the student can demonstrate that he/she has studied and practiced the drills for this. They won't generally practice approaches and landings with an engine actually out; but that's mostly because a deer or another plane or the fuel truck might inadvertently wander out onto the runway just when you're about to land. Depending on the specific circumstances it can be dangerous to attempt a climb out from a failed landing on one engine. Obviously that wouldn't apply at all to this accident.

Now the military has access to full motion, full visual simulators that cost 10's of millions of dollars. Believe me they're the same, exact thing. If you can fly the 'box' you can fly the plane. In a simulator the instructor can throw everything possible at the student and isn't limited in the least bit to safe practices. I'm sure that pilot has made dozens of one engine approaches and landings in the box. They wouldn't have put him in the plane otherwise.

[HS345]

From some of the witness accounts, it seems to me the pilot rode this aircraft almost to the ground, ejecting at the last possible moment.

[DIYourselfer]

From a friend who is an instructor pilot on the F-18:

The F/A-18 does NOT have an F-16 like EPU. They have that specifically because they are a single engine airplane. The A-4 series for instance had a RAT (Ram Air Turbine) - a little propeller that stuck out into the wind stream to supply electrical pwoer if you lost your one and only generator - but since the Hornet has two engine we consider the second engine the back-up.

The Hornet CAN NOT fly without at least one engine running. Matter of fact - we have two hyd sysems with 2 circuits each. There is a failure mode with 3 circuits (of the 4) shut down that the airplane is uncontroallble even if an engine is running. For instance - #2 engine shut down (so you lost Hyd 2A and 2B - and then ONE of the other circuits fails (for instance Hyd 1A). You still have a good running engine - but with this 3 of 4 failed hyd circuits - the plane is uncontrollable.

Now - the cable question. The stick does have a cable mechanical backup system should some of the flight comtrol computers fail - but it is tough to fly and has nothing to do with the engines. The cables aren't going to help you in the least if the egines stop running.

[ceramictec]

http://www.comcast.net/articles/news-national/20090325/F.22.Crash/


F-22 crashes in California desert near air base
59 minutes ago

http://por-img.cimcontent.net/api/assets/bin-200903/df2b-CA-JET-FIGHTER-CRASH.jpg

EDWARDS AIR FORCE BASE, Calif. — One of the Air Force's top-of-the-line F-22 fighter jets crashed Wednesday in the high desert of Southern California. There was no immediate word on whether the pilot ejected.

The F-22 Raptor crashed 35 miles northeast of Edwards Air Force Base, Pentagon spokesman Gary Strassburg said. He had no information about the area where the jet crashed.

Rescue crews were en route and the status of the pilot was unknown, said Air Force Maj. David Small at the Pentagon.

Small said the jet, assigned to the 411th Flight Test Squadron of Edwards' 412th Test Wing, was on a test mission but he did not know its nature. The crash occurred at midmorning.

Call to the base public affairs phone numbers were answered by recording machines.

The radar-evading F-22s each cost $140 million and are designed for air dominance. The warplanes can carry air-to-air missiles but are capable of ground attack as well.