Ding Dong--Michael Vick is Toast! Any Defenders Out There?

[Scooter]

News reports today report that Falcon's QB Michael Vick is indeed pleading guilty to drowning dogs in connection with a paid dog fighting ring he financed and ran. I know we've had some defenders of Barry Bonds on board, and I guess I would like to hear from anyone who thinks drowning dogs is OK.

Any Vick defenders out there?

[Sponsored Links]

[river-wear]

I think this thread is going to be a heckuva lot more effective than the "ignore this post" thread. :stick:

[dbol]

I think the HBO sports show with bryant gumbel has a special on about the dog fighting deal. It is really sad what these dogs go through. The owners of the dogs talk about how much they love their dogs too.

[LGB]

I don't condone drowning dogs, but I don't think he should lose his career because of this. Let him do his time and then see if any teams are willing to take him on. We have drug addicts, rapists and murders still playing sports for big bucks, why should Vick be banned? Coby Bryant allegedly raped a girl and is on olympic teams...

[Tom Tee]

Instead of dumming down social response to accomadate disgusting behavior how about addressing the country's legal elements for their lacking of responsibility in upholding the construct of respectability?

The malcontents of the 60's are now running the show in many circles and in the large picture, IMO, we are in trouble.

tt

[sdaniels7114]

Vick's culpability is clear. What isn't so clear is just how many NFLer's he and his underlings can place at these fights and just how far down this filthy hole Godell wants to go.

[nforcer2]

Funny how because he is liked people are still trying to justify his behavior. I personally could care less if he goes to jail or gets probation and plays ball next week, I really dont think one has anything to do with the other. But it is funny the difference someones personality can make in how they are judged.

[opiethetileman]

i say just shoot everyone of them and I will donate the bullets and 50 cal for it. its plain out bs to do that to animals. I own over 100 firearms do not hunt. just shoot for fun. but people who make animals fight cock fights or dog fights and al is plain out bllchit. they all should be shot or better yet drop their arse off in iraq will a sign around the neck shoot me i love you.

[river-wear]

Hey Opie/Dan - my "other half" had similar sentiments. He said forget jail time. Just rub him with a steak or give him an "au jus" shower and toss him in a ring with a couple of those dogs. If he lives 30 minutes, he can go back to his regular life. Without pets or animals, of course.

[John Corley]

"Any defenders out there?"

Not me! What kind of person can do that to animals? I am not a peta fanatic, but he is just over the top.

[Rob Z]

On a related note, these poor dogs get bred to be aggresive killers. It's ghastly what these dogs go through. Personally, I hope Vick does some serious time and never plays again in the NFL.

Read this story:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,294013,00.html

My buddy the Metropoliton police officer (Washington DC) tells me that almost every man on his squad has had to shoot an attacking pit bull or a rotweiler because the drug dealers have them as a form of ghetto security system in the drug houses. He only half jokingly says that they fear the dogs more than guns when they are serving an arrest warrant.

[dl]

Also on a related note, Amazon continues to defend its right to promote animal fighting by selling dog fighting videos and cock fighting magazines.

Humane Society Article (http://www.hsus.org/hsus_field/animal_fighting_the_final_round/recent_activities/amazon_com_cruelty.html)

Send the Bozo an email (https://community.hsus.org/campaign/US_2007_amazon_fighting3) and let him know what you think of this.

- DL

[Shooter]

I love animals and I like my dogs more than most human beings. I find dog fighting to be truely barbaric and I am utterly disgusted by it. However, I find it offensive that every day murderers and rapists don't get this kind of attention and many may not even suffer similar consequences for crimes of violence committed against another human being than what Vick may get. Our system and the tree huggin, hippie liberals, who IMO, have brought our country to this point, need a swift kick in the ass.

There, that should spawn about 10 pages of replies from those people. :tongue: :lol1:

[opiethetileman]

here ys go shooter. Maybe LURCH would have been a better president lol. Well I havent seen any wife fighting rings and bet. Yeah being cruel to animals is just plain wrong . you should have ur nuts chopped off with a dull old worn out used 4 inch diamond blade on the cheapest grinder that shocks ya. that should be the start of the sentence

[nforcer2]

And on the second page there is a story about a guy who is an admitted pedophile being released because the judge didnt give him a proper hearing on the order he issued stating he could not be within a certain distance of children. Where are our priorities? I agree dog fighting is barbaric and there should be some sentence, but we are so fascinated with anything to do with anybody famous that we are missing out on the really bad stuff going on that affects more than animals.

[Rob Z]

I didn't miss that story, Robert. I almost posted a link to it, along with my un-Christian desire that he meet a Jeffrey Dahmer-like fate the next time he is locked up. :mad:

And as an alum of UVa, I disliked Michael Vick long before he was in the national spotlight. :D

[Jeremy]

While I hope the idiot guilty of such cruelty to animals gets sentenced to prison time, I have a question burning inside.... Scooter, you are ok with abortion on demand, and yet you think THIS is wrong? Maybe Vick should have cut the dogs up into pieces with a "surgical" instrument, and then sucked the pieces up with a "surgical" vacuum...

Before anyone questions the relevance of my post, let me say that I am questioning the integrity of someones beliefs, NOT whether cruelty to animals is right or wrong. :idea:

[sportskid1]

Something tells me that Vick's career is done. I can't see any one taking on the PR nightmare that will come with him after he gets out of jail. Serves him right. He is going to have a lot of fun paying back the 22 million signing bonus for breach of contract though. Something tells me that it is long gone.

[opiethetileman]

ban him from all games just like they did Pete rose. its the same thing excpet its worse killing animals

[Scooter]

Dog fighting is legal in some countries. But so is beating one's daughter who was raped. I don't think the morality of the act should be judged by what might be legal somewhere else.

The last time I checked, abortion on demand is legal here for the 1st trimester.

The last time I checked, killing dogs is illegal in every state.

Killing humans is legal in a number of circustances: abortion, war, capital punishment, defense of your life. I'm down with killing humans. Heck the planet is over populated as it is, and I'm just a pro death kinda guy. :yipee:

So, yes, I value a dog's life more than an unborn fetus with a mother who doesn't want the kid. One's illegal, one's not.

[TedL]

Jeremy,

While I believe that Vick's actions are despicable, I fail to understand why they are not protected by the privacy rights that emanate from the penumbra of the US Constitution. The ones discovered in 1973.

[Scooter]

Ted

I'm a little behind on my reading, but did I miss a Supreme Court decision that upheld the torture and murder of dogs? And gambling? And struck down laws which forbade cruelty to animals?

I must have been out of town that week. Care to explain?

[Splinter]

I fail to understand why they are not protected by the privacy rights

With that logic, I could murder you Ted in the privacy of my own home, and I shouldn't be prosecuted because I have my rights to privacy... :)

Jeremy, the difference between killing a fetus and a dog, at least in my opinion, is awareness. I dont believe an undeveloped fetus has the capacity to know it's being terminated... I do believe Michael Vicks dogs suffered when the son of a bitch drowned them... But that's just my opinion... :tup1:

[HS345]

So, yes, I value a dog's life more than an unborn fetus with a mother who doesn't want the kid. One's illegal, one's not.

:shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake: :shake:

Somehow, I'm not surprised.
Sad? Yes.
Dismayed? Yes.
Disgusted? Yes.
Surprised? No.

[HS345]

Jeremy, the difference between killing a fetus and a dog, at least in my opinion, is awareness. I dont believe an undeveloped fetus has the capacity to know it's being terminated... I do believe Michael Vicks dogs suffered when the son of a bitch drowned them... But that's just my opinion
So if someone shoots you in the head while you're asleep, I guess that's cool, right?

[TedL]

Thank you all for demonstrating the illogical and inconsistent state of constitutional law in this country. And don't any of you get knocked unconscious by an accident, as there appears to be people who think it's OK to dispose of you at that point!

[Scooter]

I would only favor disposing of someone who knocked was knocked unconscious by an accident if it were a select few posters on this BB, and my former priest. Actually if it was my former priest, he wouldn't even have to be unconscious.

[flatfloor]

:topicoff:

[Theold--scottyb]

Those last few posts were great.. :tup1:

[Splinter]

So if someone shoots you in the head while you're asleep, I guess that's cool, right?

Come on Greg, that's really just a stupid thing to say, wasn't called for, and doesnt help keep the discussion civil. You know what I meant in my last post... It's my opinion that a mass of cells with less brain capacity than an expired can of tunafish is not aware of anything... I however am aware that I will wake up the next morning, and usually look forward to it, so shooting me in the head while I'm asleep would be uncalled for. Y'know, the mind is in high gear while you sleep, so I'm not sure that a person can be considered unaware while sleeping.

My opinion, Im entitled to it, worth price charged.

[Scooter]

I've also been accused of being "a mass of cells with less brain capacity than an expired can of tunafish" by my wife.

I love where a legitimate post about a fallen sports hero gets turned around into a debate about abortion or that vegetable woman in Florida whose name I forget. Terry.... Terrry..... Anyway I forget her.

As long as we are going off topic, lets compare Michael Vick to the Iraq war. Indeed, there are filings against Michael Vick that he is a member of Al Queda. See below:

[TedL]

What Michael Vick did to the dogs is sickening and illegal, and it should be.

Had he done similar things to a human baby instead, the difference would be that it would be legal.

What's wrong with this picture?

[Splinter]

Had he done similar things to a human baby instead, the difference would be that it would be legal.

Ummm, dont think so Ted... Drowning human babies is still quite illegal in most states... (Not too sure about Arkansas though :moon: )

I know what you meant though, and it's just apples and oranges, my friend.

[TedL]

Quote: "Ummm, dont think so Ted... Drowning human babies is still quite illegal in most states..."

Not if their last finger or toe hasn't exited the birth canal. Hold an arm back, and you can run scissors through their skulls.

Maybe "not the same" ...in your opinion. I haven't seen a list of distinguishing characteristics, just a conclusory argument.

[flatfloor]

This is a very touchy subject so let's keep it civil. I think dropping the subject would be a great idea.

Who derailed this anyway?

[HS345]

Come on Greg, that's really just a stupid thing to say, wasn't called for, and doesnt help keep the discussion civil. You know what I meant in my last post... It's my opinion that a mass of cells with less brain capacity than an expired can of tunafish is not aware of anything... I however am aware that I will wake up the next morning, and usually look forward to it, so shooting me in the head while I'm asleep would be uncalled for. Y'know, the mind is in high gear while you sleep, so I'm not sure that a person can be considered unaware while sleeping.

I know Alex, how utterly stupid and uncivil of me for considering HUMAN life to be more valuable than animal life. Whew, what was I thinking? Sorry Dude, my bad.

[Shooter]

Originally posted by flatfloor
This is a very touchy subject so let's keep it civil. I think dropping the subject would be a great idea.It was far too easy to have made this one nasty. Some dolts just ache for a jab. I think it is fortunate enough that many of us chose hold our tongue or the keyboard. Funny how BB seniority seems to make some feel entitled. :shake:

[Jeremy]

I would rather take a bullet to my head, than be labeled a "liberal", IF Scooters logic is widespread among that group. I didnt derail this thread, I pointed out that the original poster is seriously lacking in integrity week after week with the ant-christian, pro abortion, hate-filled posts. Its never ending, from calling people "nazis" to the comment about being ok with members of this BB being killed. A smiley face doesnt remove intent.

It is becoming more widespread for people everywhere to censor and drive away any view deemed to be associated with Christianity, while allowing the view of "others" to flow freely regardless of content or intention. There is no reality behind much of what has been said by some... For example: Scooter said that the world is overpopulated and that murder and abortion keeps a balance. Would we ever read a post from him praising the "Celtic Gods" for the murder of one of HIS children or grandchildren? Of course not. But any other murder or abortion is "population control"??? Hypocrisy maybe?

Surely its not derailing a thread when someone states an opinion which doesnt jive with anothers?

I am posting a link to a web site which contains pictures of what some of you consider "acceptable". I would like for those of you who have the opinion that killing a DOG is NOT the same as killing a BABY, to take a look at the site in the link, and any other sites you may find, and THEN tell me if you STILL feel that way... After all, how can you SUPPORT something which you cannot bear to WITNESS???


CAUTION!!!! The link to photos I am pasting here contains VILE, REPULSIVE, HORRIBLE PICTURES of DEAD MUTILATED HUMAN BABIES!!! Do not click on this link if you are repulsed by such...

http://abortionismurder.org/HTML/I-A-4-photos22.html


I have posted a clear warning, so anyone who is repulsed by such acts surely will know to NOT click the link...

[Scooter]

Actually, the world might be a better place without a few of my grandchildren. Some of them are lazy sloths that want nothing better than a handout.

Yeah, I'm anti-Catholic, but you should see my priest now and you'd understand why. I'm sure he's bent over a miner, oops, sorry a minor. Seriously, he was one of the bad guys.

Oh, and notwithstanding how long I've been here, I have been harshly critizcized for using the "F" word once in referring to my pro Iraq war anti French sentiments, e.g., "___" the French. My post was deleted. I apologized to all for the poor language and my emotional state. I got caught up in one of George Bush's speechs (we're gonna "smoke e'm out") and foolishly believed what he was saying was the truth. I will regret that for as long as I live.

I wanted to talk about Michael Vick, so why don't you guys start an abortion thread? That way you can talk to yourselves to your heart content. Post all the pictures you want. See how much action you get.

About Michael Vick, my prediction is that he will get:

16-24 months sentence. Serve 12-14. 2 year ban AFTER serving the sentence.

What he should get is 36 months in jail, and a 5 year ban after serving the sentence which would be equilvalent to a lifetime ban.

I'm not altogether sure that the NFL won't ban him for life. Its all about corporate America and corporate America dispizes animal cruelty--its bad for business. In addition, Vick lied to the Commish. I wouldn't be surprized if he is gone for life.

I do the like the other poster's idea to drip him in Vegetable Beef Soup and let him spend 30 minutes with 12 hungry and pissed off PitBulls. If he can survive for 30 minutes, then you go, Michael.

Any other predictions what the criminal justice system and the NFL will do to the guy?

.

[MudMaker]

It's true Jim..
Let somebody kill 7 dogs and the country is in an outrage..
Kill millions of babies and....that's OK...Something IS wrong with that pic...

[flatfloor]

Based on the plea bargain agreed to and Federal guidelines, sentencing is based on a point system which means maximum he will get is 18 months.

His NFL punishment will be based on admission of promoting gambling and lying to the commissioner. According to the talking heads he may not see a pro football camp until at least '09.

[Scooter]

Guidlines were thrown out by the Supreme Court about 2 years ago--the trial judges are not constrained by Sentencing Guidelines. They have the discretion to go above or below those, give the guy nothing or the maximum. This is a hanging judge from what I've been told.

Two years out of the game might be right--I hope not--but I wouldn't be surprised.

Nicole Richy spend like 8 hours in jail for her 4 day term, so nothing surprises me about high profile defendants anymore.

[Westie]

If he ever gets to play in the NFL there needs to be a clause in his contact that allows the team owner to crush his head against a concrete floor, drown or electrocute him for poor performance in a game. :shake:

[flatfloor]

He is going to take a huge financial hit as a result of lost endorsements. :clap1:

http://sports-law.blogspot.com/2007/07/morals-clauses-and-michael-vicks.html

[river-wear]

Hey guys, found a defender for this dude: Jamie Foxx, the actor. (Yeah, leave it to the acting community in a time like this. They routinely say Fidel Castro isn't such a bad guy too...) This is from the "Access Hollywood" website. NO I DON'T READ THE SITE, just found a link to it. :loaded:

**
Although Vick has been almost universally condemned since agreeing to plead guilty to dog fighting conspiracy, according to Foxx, people should not be so quick to judge the NFL star.

“It’s a cultural thing, I think,” Jamie said. “Most brothers didn’t know that, you know. I used to see dogs fighting in the neighborhood all the time. I didn’t know that was Fed time. So, mike probably just didn’t read his handbook on what not to do as a black star.”
**

If I were a member of the same "culture" I think I'd be mighty offended right now. But I guess no one would call him racist. (That isn't what this thread is about either, so let's not get derailed again. Please.)

[Scooter]

The problem lies with two culture clashes as you suggest.

The Gangsta "Got to be Real" culture. Lets do some crack, bitch slap some Ho's, and get down.

The NFL public spotlight and corporate America with big bucks.

My thought is this--If want the big bucks, then you hafta sign up for being in the spotlight and yes you are an example to all the kids. You have to drop the "keep it real" attitude and the crack pipes at the locker door.

I will also point out that this whole deal unwraveld because one of his relatives was caught with drugs in one of Vicks homes. Thats sure "keepin' it real". I suspect he had coke, dogs, and ho's all going on at the same time.

Sorry Michael. Keeping it real does not mean doing things against the law.

[Scooter]

NFL suspended him INDEFINITELY.

That means to me that he is out for life. If he gets out of prison and does community service, joins the ASPCA, volunteers to fight in Pat Tillmans's footsteps, they might let him in.

Suspension without pay, I might add.

[chuck stevenson]

Ron Mexico probably dosn't have the money to pay back for breech of contract.

[Scooter]

Its a good thing he pled out. CNN got an advance look at his jury:

[dgunnels]

I don't want any "culture" that condones cruelty and abuse whether it be of chldren, dogs, women or old people. Right is right, wrong is wrong. Black or white or tan or yellow is irrelevant.

[river-wear]

No kidding! Examples can be found all over the world where humans harm one another in the name of culture, religion or tradition. Doesn't make it right.

[Mountain Tile]

Hey Scooter, that was a good one with the jury, but personally I always thought vick was and is a punk, and you know what, he"s not even a good quarterback, he"s a freakin video game. All you have to do is contain him and make him beat you with his arm and ya know, he cant do it, he sucks, I dont get it, they were paying that punk all that money to run around like an idiot. Then when he"s exposed for his incompitence he gets mad and flips off the fans. If he tried that crap in Philly, he would be in trouble, especially when it snows :yeah: I think this is one time where money wont matter and justice will prevail.

[Beaux]

Welcome to the FREE WORLD..Chuck...LOL. SHOw U Rite Vick sucks never realy was a Pro QB, but, what do I know I can't play pro football. With out the R.I.C.O act he probably was'en going to do any time "First Offender" but being high profile, and the hanis parts of the crime. I think he deserver's more than what he is gona get. Yet in my state he would of walked with a little probation no jail time. Damn his Luck. :lol1:

[Rob Z]

If this had been cock fighting I bet not nearly as many people would be :complain: . Dogs are higher up on the food chain and I think not as many would care about a rooster with the brains of an amoeba slicing up another rooster.

The feds should come to the DC area. With all the latinos here, there are a lot of palenques (cock fights) going on in basements and back rooms all over the place. A lot.

[Wiley]

I'm tired of hearing that Vick says he made a "mistake". Calling a wrong number because you press a 4 instead of a 5 is a mistake. Getting pleasure out of watching or contributing to an animal's pain or death is not a mistake, it's a choice. A sick choice. And I hope he pays dearly.

[kate42]

:wave:

A link to the Michael Vick chew toy
http://www.vickdogchewtoy.com/

:D

[river-wear]

Found another defender - Whoopi Goldberg on The View:
"He's from the South, from the Deep South ... This is part of his cultural upbringing,"
"For a lot of people, dogs are sport," Goldberg said on the show. "Instead of just saying (Vick) is a beast and he's a monster, this is a kid who comes from a culture where this is not questioned."

From what I hear, he's from Newport News, VA - since when is that the "deep south?" :suspect:

[flatfloor]

I could buy into the "sport" thing but electrocuting them? No way, that's cruelty for pleasure, just sick.

[ceramictec]

anyone think it was too short of a stay ?

and I dont want to see him back in the NFL.
thats like a slap in the face to the good players that dont get in trouble.


RICHMOND, Va. (AP)—Suspended NFL star Michael Vick(notes) left a Kansas prison before dawn Wednesday to begin home confinement in Virginia, one of his attorneys said, the latest step on a journey that Vick hopes will lead to his reinstatement.

Vick, who turns 29 in June, slipped past waiting cameras and reporters undetected to leave a federal penitentiary in Leavenworth after serving 19 months for financing a dogfighting ring. He was headed to Virginia by car to begin two months of home confinement at his five-bedroom house in Hampton before a scheduled released from federal custody on July 20.

He was accompanied by his fiance, Kijafa Frink, and they are traveling back to Virginia with several members of a security team arranged for by Vick’s team of lawyers and advisers, person familiar with the plans told The Associated Press on condition of anonymity.

The drive from Leavenworth to Vick’s Hampton home is expected to take about 19 hours.

“It’s a happy day for him to be starting this part of the process,” Larry Woodward, Vick’s Virginia-based attorney, said. “He looks forward to meeting the challenges he has to meet.”

Ultimately, Vick’s goal is to rehabilitate his image and return to the NFL, but Woodward said his first priority “is spending time with his children and his loved ones.”

Vick, once the NFL’s highest-paid player, is scheduled to report to a probation officer Friday in Norfolk, Woodward said. He will be allowed to leave the house to work a $10-an-hour job as a laborer for a construction company and for other limited purposes approved by his probation officer. He will be handed a new set of rules when he begins serving three years of probation after he is released.

[ob1kanobee]

Whatever time he did he did. Too long too short not for me to judge.

I'm no fan of Vick. Being a huge dog lover, when I heard of what he did I wanted him to be thrown into a pit of flesh eating swine like Hanibel Lector was in the movie.

I believe most people are allowed a second chance after things catch up with them. Heck, sometimes multiple chances. I'm indifferent (don't care) as to whether he goes back into the NFL. Don't think it is going to cause me to lose any sleep.

[Kilauea]

Ive got mixed emotions on this subject.Not only do I think fighting dogs is cruel(mans best friend)but I think Pit Bulls in general are dangerous for the general public,especially if you have children.These animals are bred for one thing-fight to the death.How often do you hear of a German Shepard,Great Dane,or Rottweiler getting loose and mauling people and other dogs.Im sure it happens but not as frequently as pits.We live in North TX and it is very common to read these attacks in the paper or the local TV news.One of my neighbors down the street raises and I think fights them.Ive gotten extra protection just in case if one gets loose and my kids are outside.

On the other hand,I dont personally fight chickens or even have an interest in it,but was raised around the element.In HI cock fighting is very common,especially w/the filipinos.Now,Im not gonna say that fighting birds is completely innocent,but it is or atleast was legal in some states(derbies).I have immediate family that have raised these animals for many,many years and used to fly over here to enter their prized birds in these legal derbies.If any of you ever been to HI and been in the country youll see fighting birds in peoples yards are very,very common.cock fights or dog fights and al is plain out bllchit. they all should be shot or better yet drop their arse off in iraq will a sign around the neck shoot me i love you.
__________________
Dan


K9 Unit tile

Thats a pretty bold statement,my friend.Do you really think that a couple hundred of men,women,and even children whove gathered to fight their birds should be shot????:stupid2::wtf::cry:

[Kilauea]

The problem lies with two culture clashes as you suggest.

The Gangsta "Got to be Real" culture. Lets do some crack, bitch slap some Ho's, and get down.

The NFL public spotlight and corporate America with big bucks.

My thought is this--If want the big bucks, then you hafta sign up for being in the spotlight and yes you are an example to all the kids. You have to drop the "keep it real" attitude and the crack pipes at the locker door.

I will also point out that this whole deal unwraveld because one of his relatives was caught with drugs in one of Vicks homes. Thats sure "keepin' it real". I suspect he had coke, dogs, and ho's all going on at the same time.

Sorry Michael. Keeping it real does not mean doing things against the law.
__________________
Scooter
"Sir, I May Be Drunk, But You're Crazy, and I'll Be Sober Tomorrow"
WC Fields, "Its a Gift" 1934


EEEEE-EEEEE-EEEEE(alarm clock).....Good morning,Scooter,and welcome to the 21st century!Here in America where people who might have some "urban" interests dont necessarily fit into your little "keepin it real"category.I dont necessarily like Michael Vick,but its not because Ive got red shoelaces in my combat boots,nor do I burn crosses in peoples yard.Whats up w/this "gansta" talk anyways?Are you affiliating every athlete who might have urban interests?Thats a WHOOOOOLE lot of athletes.Get used to it,cause its only going to increase from here on out.Just look at the numbers.Music,fashion,automobiles etc.Whats up w/the crack at the locker room???What the @#$% does this have to to w/Vicks case?WAS HE CHARGED W/THAT TO?Im sure youve got some relatives somewhere down the line that just mightve done a little somethin,perhaps even you.Is drug use permissable at the honky tonk bar?In fact,last weekend,one of my close friends (he's black) rode up to my hood,and decided to "get down"(off of his horse).Yesterday I wanted to "keep it real" so,I found a Ho,put my hands on that Ho,and worked that Ho(in the garden).....:nod:

[tilerite]

EEEEE-EEEEE-EEEEE(alarm clock).....Good morning,Scooter,and welcome to the 21st century

Scooter has left the house.

[java]

M. Vick is a thug.

Now some pictures of my killer lap dogs.

[ceramictec]

cool cat in the 3rd pic :D

[ceramictec]

Former Atlanta Falcons quarterback Michael Vick – who was suspended indefinitely in August 2007 after pleading guilty to funding a dogfighting ring – is getting another chance in the National Football League.

NFL commissioner Roger Goodell reinstated Vick on a conditional basis, which means he can sign with a team and practice, but won't be able to play in regular-season games. Goodell says he will monitor Vick's progress and decide if can play by mid-October.

What do you think of the decision? Do you think Vick deserves a second chance in the NFL or not?

Share your opinion on video. Keep your thoughts clear and concise, and you could be featured on CNN.

[ceramictec]

who gets the number 1 spot ?..........

http://www.forbes.com/2009/07/28/the-most-disliked-people-in-sports-business-sports-disliked_slide_2.html?partner=yahoosports


No. 1 Michael Vick

NFL

Pct. dislike: 72%

Few things can turn public opinion against you like prison time for financing a dog fighting ring. The good news: With his dislike score based on a single incident, the former Atlanta Falcons quarterback stands a good chance of turning things around with exemplary behavior once reinstated to the league.


* I don't think he should be able to come back and play.
this is showing the youth of today that committing a crime and going to jail can be rewarded with being a superstar again in the NFL.

[organic_smallhome]

JMO: When he first got caught, he blamed it on his family. A person who is capable of torturing animals for YEARS is a deeply disturbed person. I hardly think that 2 years in a limpid prison facility has made the slightest bit of difference to his understanding of what it is to be at least a decent human being. Michael Vick is a monster. I've already written the Pats (who are rumored to be considering him) and registered my complaint: They hire Vick and there will be no more airing of any Patriots games in our home. I've already informed my husband of this possibility. :mad:

[jondon]

I went back and followed this thread from the first posting and I agree we all have our own thoughts on the matter. I do think with all these professionals in the public eye they do have a certain image they should uphold, they are not only idolized by children but need I say it, adults too. Sports Pro and college is big money(speaking of college football), so what is gonna happen when he is with another team, the stadium is going to be filled, people who support that team are gonna support him, so I think him coming back into the NFL, will bring in more money to the NFL than if he is banned. Pete Rose was banned for his activities but diff tween now and then is Vick is only 29. Money, just like the money that was being bet on in his dogfights, wasn't he making enough in the NFL and with endorsements....lil greedy? Yeh Whoopi, he ran dogfighting as a youngsta so he has to carry that on, gimme a break. She could have come up with something a lil better. We have to take responsiblity for our actions and what we did when we were growing up does not alleviate justice.

I am a dog lover and have always loved animals. My point is I think there are a few of us animal lovers in the NFL, lets let them welcome Vick back! If he really is sorry and starts some cause for the protection of animals from people from himself, then I'll start to believe he is a diff person than when he went in. Anyone can do wrong and change, I think we'll all see if he has turned over a new leaf or not. Time will tell.

[ceramictec]

Why are Professional Sport so Forgiving?$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

[jondon]

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Yes Brian I think that was one of my major points...MO $$$:tup1:

Sports Pro and college is big money(speaking of college football), so what is gonna happen when he is with another team, the stadium is going to be filled, people who support that team are gonna support him, so I think him coming back into the NFL, will bring in more money to the NFL than if he is banned.

[organic_smallhome]

Jason: Your dogs are gorgeous. (And the kids aren't bad, either--lol!)

[Kilauea]

Yeah,its been rumored that the Cowboys might be interested in him.I swear Jerry Jones gets a (wont say) for trouble makers.I hope this a-hole doesnt come here.Thats all we need is more bad publicity.

Java,youve got a great lookin family:tup2:.But no matter how much you dress them up the animals have been bred for one thing.We all know what that is.Pit fighting.Hence the word PIT bulls/born and bred killers.Now Ive got nothing against god's creations be it pit bulls,mountain lions,polar bears,wolverines,black mambas,white sharks,tigers etc.Yeah youre right,pits have gotten a bad rap over the years and thats probably because they DESERVE it.My neighbors across the street raise them.I see first hand why they are the most common of dogs that will attack and kill not only other dogs but people and worse than that,small people.

Yeah its a shame that when one of their dogs get loose and my kids are in the yard Ive got to keep some heat close by.

[organic_smallhome]

Actually, pits are not raised for fighting. They've gotten a bad rap because the wrong people have gotten hold of them. The fact that your neighbors are breeding pits is precisely one of the problems. This country is overrun with ignorant breeders of animals. Pits, by nature, are lovers--not fighters. Any animal can be turned into a killing machine with enough abuse, neglect, and/or lack of training. A tragedy, really.

An instructive video:

http://gprime.net/flash.php/thepitbullproblem

[Kilauea]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mef5uvKP_4Q

Actually, pits are not raised for fighting. They've gotten a bad rap because the wrong people have gotten hold of them. The fact that your neighbors are breeding pits is precisely one of the problems. This country is overrun with ignorant breeders of animals. Pits, by nature, are lovers--not fighters

Maybe todays owners arent "raising" them specifically for fighting,but its in their genetics.Its just like fighting chickens.Theyve been bred specifically for fighting.Dont argue w/me its a historical fact.It has been a fact before any of us on this forum were even born.I mean you're not gonna take a poodle to go hunting boars.Different animals especially dogs have been bred over the centuries for different things.

And my neighbors arent really ignorant.They are just one of the millions of Americans that are like,"look at me ,Im bad ass,Ive got pit bulls:wohoo:I mean yeah you can say they're ignorant breeders,I disagree.I say ignorant owners.I mean even the Dog whisperer wouldnt be able to change these animals under unfavorable conditions.There is lot of other dogs that you can have.I think its pathetic that people try to dress these animals up.I mean Im sure those gay entertainers sigfried or whatever could put make up and sunglasses on their tigers.And what?Is that supposed to change the fact that you could be in a life or death situation.Every where around where we live people are selling pits on the side of the road.Everyone wants to be a badass.When these animals crawl under a fence or slip out of their collar its not their fault when they maul someone or kill another dog.ITS THE OWNERS FAULT FOR HAVIN EM TO BEGIN WITH!!!!These animals ARE dangerous.I dont give a s@#% what you say.Ive seen first hand what these animals are capable of and it wasnt because they were "raised" for fighting.Its cause they were bred for it.I dont care if they get raised by nuns!!

[Kilauea]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dxbOBMPlJKw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qlwgs05F5vA

Yeah the dog owner in this first video is a freakin retard.Yeah ofcourse you didnt raise em to attack----its in their genetics!!!!!!!!!!!
Pits, by nature, are loversOriginally quoted by Organic_smallhomes

OOOOK.Im just curious what planet were talkin about

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yVHX8-k7aQ

What about this?Another "irresponsible breeder"?OK.Doesnt look like alot of raised for "fighting" goin on either.Maybe just maybe,she hooks up w/ole Vick and enters her dog in the fighting circuit...No?Or-maybe its just vicious because 100+ generations before him were bred for just that...

[organic_smallhome]

I'm sorry, but you are misinformed about the nature of pit bulls. Your personal experience is no indication of a general truth about the breed. I could just as easily pull up many stories of people mauled by other breeds.

You are perfectly entitled, of course, to believe what you choose to believe. But, in my view, it's always best to become informed before forming an opinion.

http://www.badrap.org/rescue/myths.cfm

http://www.americanhumane.org/assets/docs/protecting-animals/PA-resources-pit-bull-myths.pdf

http://www.pbrc.net/mediacenter/mediaqa.html

[Tiletim]

I like Golden retrievers so I can't comment on the discussion about dogs you two have going on.

Back to Vick - the viQueens look like they may need a QB - T-jack may have sprained something at camp yesterday.

MN has a long history of getting some of the "cream of the crop" out there!

Look at Farve - nuff said

back to the dog fight!

[Kilauea]

You are perfectly entitled, of course, to believe what you choose to believe. But, in my view, it's always best to become informed before forming an opinion. Originally quoted by Michelle

Im just believing what Ive seen,felt,and experienced.Those were just some clips that were easily accessable that you can see.Ive got lots of friends in HI and in TX that have pits.Some fight them others use them to guard stuff but most just use them as house pets and dont abuse them at all.Im not some judgemental person that sits in a corner somewhere.Ive been around pitbulls alot.Even if nobody ever reported attacks Id still feel the same way from my physical experiences.And its definitely not something a FREAKIN child should be subjected to.So tell me,Michelle what "literature" should I read thats going to inform me more than many physical experiences around pitbulls.

[Kilauea]

Ok I read your literature.What I gave you was actual footage.But face it.The predominant reason for pit bull breeding by our recent ancestors is for aggression.Its not what I choose to believe.Thanks to you suggesting that I get "informed" has only help me soldify my own real experiences.Heres is some for ya thatll tell ya a little of their history(by pit bull lovers).I like em ,too.Heck Ive even got a tattoo of one.I wouldnt own one now,Ive got small kids.I dont need a pit bull to be tough anyways:D

[ceramictec]

They've gotten a bad rap because the wrong people have gotten hold of them.

[Kilauea]

Sorry,but Im not gonna back down this time.Come to think of it,we had to do an install the other day and this lady (H.O.)had 2 pit bulls.She DOESNT fight them or train them to fight.Comprende?The dogs are simply pets.Nothing more nothing less.No brutal beatings.No burns from the torch.Everything was goin swell(snappin lines etc.).One of my helpers commences to mix some versabond,and one of these dogs flipped the F@#$ out on him.It was very intense.Luckily the homeowner was there and was able to hold her while he got behind a door.Is this because this 50+ year old lady got her hands on one?Is this the wrong people you are insinuating?

They've gotten a bad rap because the wrong people have gotten hold of them.

I agree 100%.The wrong people meaning the ones who bred them for aggression 200+ years ago until now.And now people who want a dog and get a pit potentially have a very rude awakening......whether they abuse them or NOT:bang:!

Take this 4 year old girl for example:Cenedi Kia Carey--Cant say for sure but it doesnt sound like the "wrong people".Sounds more like the "wrong dog".Can you imagine the look on that little four year old's fathers face when he seen what happened???I wonder if he took pics with the 2 dogs and his kids dressed up with sunglasses and such:shake:

[jondon]

Back to Vick - the viQueens look like they may need a QB - T-jack may have sprained something at camp yesterday.

Tim, good one:wohoo:

I still think he would be a better running back or wide receiver. Its obvious he's not good at "runnin the show"

Didn't Vick have a younger brother who was supposed to be better than he was, maybe I am wrong, but my understanding was the younger brother was supposed to be better than Mike. Sorry if I am way off on this was just curious.

[ceramictec]

(AP) – 24 minutes ago

QB Michael Vick Signs 2-Year Deal With Eagles
Ex-Atlanta Falcons star quarterback Michael Vick signs 2-year deal with the Philadelphia Eagles

Michael Vick is back in the NFL, landing a job with the Philadelphia Eagles. "He signed with the Eagles," agent Joel Segal told The Associated Press in a telephone interview Thursday. He said it was a two-year deal.

Vick, once the NFL's highest-paid player, has not played since 2006. The former Atlanta Falcons quarterback was convicted in August 2007 of conspiracy and running a dogfighting operation, and served 18 of a 23-month sentence in federal prison.
He also was suspended indefinitely by the NFL.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------

nice message the NFL is sending out to all the kids in the street...
its cool to commit crime, your reward is another multi-milion contract!

[tilerite]

I;m no longer an Eagles fan. This is horribly disgusting.

[ceramictec]

Governor Rendell Comments On Eagles' Signing Of Michael Vick
Pennsylvania Governor Ed Rendell released the following statement in response to the Philadelphia Eagles' signing of Michael Vick:


"I believe that I don't have to take a back seat to anyone in my commitment to helping protect all animals, and specifically our dogs and puppies. I am enormously proud of the progress we have made through the enactment of our new dog law and stepped-up enforcement efforts.

"I also believe strongly in the tenets of rehabilitation and redemption. I believe Michael Vick has paid a strong and just penalty for his horrific acts, but he has endured that penalty with dignity and grace. He seems to be genuinely remorseful for what he has done.

"Michael Vick's work with the Humane Society has been a positive step and I believe he will continue to be an advocate for protecting our canine friends. His experience will add extra weight to that message, and I look forward to working with him toward achieving that goal."

[ceramictec]

Do you agree with the Philadelphia Eagles decision to sign Micheal Vick?


Yes (39.6%)

No (60.4%)

[jondon]

Well if anything good comes out of it maybe Vick can learn a little bout class from Donovan.

[sandbagger]

Vick should have paid the Eagles.... :deal:

[Mountain Tile]

The man did his time, served his punishment, lost everything. Why shouldn't he get another chance? I guess everybody on here is perfect, never did anything wrong. Give him a chance, if he screws up again he will be done for good. I think the Eagles will give him the best chance to turn it around.

[jondon]

Hey Chuck, how is business up your way? Good I hope:tup1:

Yes I like what you just said:goodpost:, everyone deserves a second chance and I know we have all done things that we would like to take back. If he can make something positive out of this then he bettered himself. Hopefully all the attention will not be taken away from the Eagles now, like when TO goes to a new team!

[ceramictec]

The man did his time, served his punishment, lost everything. Why shouldn't he get another chance? I guess everybody on here is perfect, never did anything wrong. Give him a chance, if he screws up again he will be done for good.I agree he should be given another chance. the thing is he is a role model for kids and this shouldn't be accepted in pro sports.
all these pros carrying guns, running illegal dog fighting rings, doing steroids/drugs shouldn't be rewarded with a 6.5 million 2 year contract.
there's another young kid ready to fill his shoes that's doing things by the book.

people need to have ethics and not over look these criminals just to see their team score a TD.

[pooky]

did the time, said the right things -- time to elevate as a player and as a human being

Just like the rest of us -- he must strive and grow.

[tilelayer]

only in Philly baby!

[tilerite]

did the time, said the right things -- time to elevate as a player and as a human being

And you think he was being sincere?? The man is a piece of shit. I see right through his phony act. No remorse at all. This all about money.

[Mountain Tile]

Thanks Jon, yea business is going crazy right now, it's sunday and I'm getting ready to go finish a sunroom floor. I know what your saying Brian, but hopefully he will turn it around and maybe some kids who have trouble will see what can happen if you can change. I'm not a fan of the guy, but I'm pulling for him. You know Philly, tough town, if he helps them win he will be a hero, if he sucks and screws up on top of it, they will tar and feather him. Either way it sure will be interesting to watch.