waterspots, sealers, and granite

[judaroonie]

I've been searching your neat site for 90 minutes and I don't quite get the answer to my question. My question is whether absorption of water that leads to darkening of granite for hours, (even overnight) means the sealer is inadequate? I have a Home Depot combo granite-sink 48'" beige granite countertop (purchased in Ontario and installed in 5/06 in a cottage). The paperwork says it's made by Pegasus. It has developed slight permanent shadowing around the faucet handles where hands drip after washing. So, despite the paperwork saying it was "factory sealed" I went to Home Depot and bought their recommended sealer. Sorry I don't have the name right now, green bottle they've now placed right by these countertops in the store. I've sealed it 3 times, but it seems to have made no difference in how easily or how long it stays darkened by water. The sealer did darken the overall granite slightly so the original shadowing is barely noticeable. I spoke with their customer service person and he said if I've sealed it several times, not to worry, water will not permanently discolor it anymore. I remain skeptical. Looks crappy when wet and a bathroom sink is frequently wet from usual drips. Do I need to reseal? Should I get another sealing product? So glad I paid more to have something that looks lousy and is so fussy. Thanks for your help.

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[Davestone]

Well, could be a few things.1 The plumber may have used plumbers putty around the faucet handles and it soaked into the stone,the putty would need to be removed, and a poutice applied to the stone.2Silicone,wd40,or oil, or even liquid soap may be the culprit,granite will soak up both these, the soap will be easy to remove, the silicone much harder,once again a poultice might remove it.3You simply didn't get a good sealing job,sealer needs to be allowed to soak in for 5 minutes or so, just don't allow it to dry on the surface.Even a mediocre sealer should seal it farly well.If you let water sit on other spots does it soak in?If not then one of the other things i mentioned is the culprit,also, a basic impregnating sealer shouldn't darken stone.

[GraniteGirl]

The vanities by Pegasus are mainly Chnese in origin and could be as absobant as a good sponge :yeah:

This does not make them bad, though. If sealed good (and by this I mean it might need to be sealed more than once - or even a few times - to be effective) they will perform just fine.

Before sealing, the stone needs to be perfectly dry and clean, though. Do like Dave suggested and find out if the plumber used plumbers' putty in the stone. This is not a disaster - just a minor irritation :D It could be poulticed out, but it might just take some time. The same will go for a soap stain. It could be removed farly easily - just not neccesarily really quickly.

Once the vanity is dry, clean the top with acetone to remove all dust and oily residue and with denatured alcohol to remove any organic contaminants. Apply the sealer as per the directions on the bottle. The factory sealer in a lot of instances is merely a wax and does not last very long. Leave the sealer to dry for 24 hours and test to see if the stone still absorbs. If it does, re-apply the sealer, wait a day and re-test. Do this until the water beads up.

I am not familiar with any of the Lowe's brand sealers, but would shop around for something more "professional grade". The TYW store has some good quality ones.

Just to clarify a point Dave made too - an impregnating sealer will not permanently darken the stone. It might go darker initially as the sealer is absorbed, but the stone will eventually return to its' original color as the solvent/transport medium of the sealer evaporates.

[judaroonie]

Thank you. Answering some of your questions, anywhere water soaks in and discolors; around the sink, out toward the edges. Since people drip at the handles, that's where it's wet, then permanently shadowed. I will check with the plumber however.

I sealed 3 times, 2 of those times waiting 6-10 minutes by a clock per the directions, then wiped off with microfiber. The second of the 3 times I got distracted and went over 10 minutes. I nearly couldn't wipe it clean...sticky, whitish glaze was developing. But with enough rubbing, all came out to a nice shiny finish. (But no improvement in absorption). I can look for a better sealer, I've seen several on your site. To clarify?.....you are suggesting letting a sealer dry (without wiping off excess) for 24 hours before testing for beading? Or are you saying to wipe off in a few minutes as usual, but let thoroughly dry for 24 hours before testing? And keep repeating this process until water beads up and no darkening occurs, even temporarily? Thanks again.

[GraniteGirl]

Apologies for the confusing statement. :o

Apply the sealer as per the directions of the manufacturer - being sure to remove all sealer residue when you apply it. (It can be a pain to remove if left too long) Wait for 24 hours between applications to give the sealer time to reach its' maximum efficacy.

Keep sealing and testing until all water beads up and no more darkening of the stone occurs.

It is important that the stone is dry before you seal it. (i.e. all dark spots must be gone) The water will still evaporate after sealing, but it will take much much longer. Use a hair dryer or dehumidifier to hasten the process along.

[NorthernNewbiegirl]

I am brand new to this site but will probably be spending lots of time here since I am in the process of building a home and have no clue how to tile!
After reading this post however...I realized I JUST BOUGHT the EXACT same granite vanity top as Judieroonie!!!
Im not sire if thats a good thing or a bad thing!
I bought it at Home Depot here in Wisconsin

After reading the post..should I before we even install the vanity..SEAL IT ???
Rightnow it is in the box untouched.
Obviously it has a nice shiney sheen to the granite already.

Are we saying here its OK to SEAL RIGHT over this granite ???
Should I do this JUST to be safe???

If any suggestions when the we install the SINK faucet??? Should I avoid using plumbers puuty?? Silicone?? How should we SEAL around those faucets then???

Hope I dont sound to "green" here....sounds like everyone here is a great support and good source of info!!
Any for me would be helpful!!

Thank You!!:)

[GraniteGirl]

The fact that the stone is shiny has no bearing on wether it absorbs water or not. Sealers do not make stone more or less shiny either.

An impregnating sealer is designed to absorb into the stone and - for lack of a better image - block the pores of the stone so other liquids will not be absorbed.

Get a good quality impregnating sealer, install your vanity and seal it before you start using it. Your vanity will be fine :)

[judaroonie]

Thanks for the clarification. I just ordered some Bulletproof. I will be back at my cottage the week of 8/12, and will do as Granitegirl suggests. Then I'll repost to let NorthernNewbieGirl know how many coats it took. I find it interesting that Home Depot claims they "haven't heard of this issue". I also plan on seeing if they'll allow a return on the $35 granite sealer they're selling next to these countertops (at least in Ontario) which appears insufficient for their product.

[MasterGranite]

I did some research on the Pegasus vanity tops from HD. Their paperwork says that the granite is pre-sealed, which makes sense. Most if not all fabricators that make granite tops would seal as the last step before installation. The issue here would be not all sealers are equal though so you might need additional sealing and also you would need to re-seal once a year if the absorption of water bothers you, i.e. leaves unsightly water marks when wet. Some granite you cannot see the water marks, the lighter the granite the more likely you will see the water marks, the darker the granite dirt will show up more.
Another tid bit - the Pegasus granite is pre-fabbed in China, which explains the lower cost.

[claycarson]

Don't know this particular granite.

But granite can be very dense and non absorbent, or it can be, as Granite Girl said, spongelike. (Don't you hate it when she's almost always right? Graniite Girl, stop that at once!!! :devil: )

To prove it, I had an instructor lay a glass of water on a granite tile for half an hour. There was drops of condensation dripping down the glass, sitting on the granite, and then soaking through to the bottom of the tile in less than 15 minutes! Point made and proved.

I believe that regardless of the sealer product you use, the bottom line is that it's unrealistic to expect that sealer will take a highly porous stone and turn it into a impervious surface. Seems like this stone is a brittle sponge.

Not saying sealer will hurt, but it may not transform it into a winner, either.

[doitright]

Hi Clay :)

I'll disagree with you on this one. I was at a sealer training class, and they used their product to seal a sand & cement cup (small). They filled it with water and it didn't leak. They then put their lips on the exterior of the cup and blew. Alas, there was air bubbles coming from the water in the cup. Now that is some good vapor transmission! :nod:

[claycarson]

John, I stand corrected.

Maybe that means there's some hope for Judaroonie and other Pegasus owners.

I love the name Judaroonie. My wife's name is Judy, so I believe that's what I'm going to start calling her. :cool:

[judaroonie]

So flatterered you like my kids' nickname for me. I am a Judy as well. Now to the promised follow-up on my porous granite Home Depot vanity top.

First, the sealer Home Depot (in Ontario) sells next to these countertops is SurfaceGard Penetrating Sealer by Tilelab. Green bottle with yellow cap and has a DuPont Teflon labe on it. It's from Custom Building Products in USA. It says to leave it on 5-10 minutes before wiping clean. I had sealed the top 3 times without change which is why I eventually found this users group.

After responses above from GraniteGirl and others, I bought some Bulletproof (twice the price) and applied it last week. After 2 coats, water beaded up and didn't soak in for an hour; a personal record. So I did a third coat the next day. The result has been perfect. I did notice slight absorption under a wet water glass that sat several hours, but overall, excellent. Of note, Bulletproof requires leaving it on 15-30 minutes before wiping clean, and I did the max each time. Makes me wonder if it's the product, or the soaking time.

Either way, thanks to everyone who responded to my dilemma. I intend to follow up with the Customer Service folks both at Home Depot and at the Pegasis distributer (they weren't much help when I called a month ago) to tell them what I've learned. There must be lots of other poor, ignorant, Home Depot granite owners with my problem.

[doitright]

Hi Judy :)

Thanks for the update! Good to hear you are back on track. :tup2: