Bad Work: The Hall Of Shame

[Trask]

Anyone got pics of really bad tile jobs? I'm starting to see a bunch of jobs that fall into the catagory of what where you thinking . Then it occured to me that I should start taking pics for my own personal Hall of Shame :D I don't really have many yet but I'll bet you guys do.

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[Scooter]

I'll snap some pictures of my own jobs, if thats what you mean.

[scott anthony]

This job actually came out dam good, but cost me an extra 1/2 day to work around over 70 broken tiles. I took pics just in case.

[Rd Tile]

Was called to complete a mud floor when installer had no idea of how to continue, whan I got there, found greenboard over the lead pan tiled to the bottom with mastic, you guessed it, pan flat on the floor, no pre-slope, picture taken during the first step of demo, re-did it all 10" up walls with CPE liner and new CBU on the walls, I only guaranteed that part, the rest stayed. :rolleyes:

[Trask]

That's what im talking bout :clap2: .. Who still uses lead pans? It looks newer is why I ask, I've pulled some out of old homes but never anything newer.

[Tool Guy - Kg]

Pans, who needs pans? Ask the guys in Florida. Should have lots of pichers from what they've had to deal with. :)

[Splinter]

I passed on a shower job last year because the plumber on the project installed a lead pan flat on the subfloor, and drywall guys hung one course of Permabase (3' high) and the rest was greenboard, no vapor barrier behind anywhere. I tried to talk the homeowner into a Kerdi shower, but she passed. The hack she hired had to return 3 times to fix his errors. ( I was there handling other parts of the remodel project) Why would anyone install a lead pan anymore?? It's not a code requirement here... :bang: :complain: :eek: :uhh:

[MHI]

At least in Florida its mostly slab on grade. I tore out a new shower that had no pan on a wood floor. The tile guy just stuck the tile to the plywood subfloor. His Plumber used an elbow for the drain, no P trap.:)

It leaked into the basement the first time they used it.

[Trask]

:rofl: I'm laughing because I've lost so many bids in the last six months to this kind of thing. Last week one of the guys that beat me (by half) came into the store to ask some questions about "how " to make a handicap shower waterproof. LONG story short, he had 1/4" wonderboard on the walls and was "planning" on double layering it cause that's what the guy at HD told him would make it waterproof. The Pan was Ice&water sheild not even laminated to the drain. When I informed the homeowner that I was "alarmed at some of the questions he asked me she said"well it looks good so far" :tup2: What'ya do. :scratch:

[flatfloor]

Ask if you can come back next year to take pictures of the failure. :D

[Trask]

:tup2:

[Tool Guy - Kg]

Yeah, tell her you're aiming to photograph the "Craptactular Shower of the Year Award" and you think her shower will do nicely in next year's competition. :nod:

[JTG]

Here is a quick submission of a shower in need of HELP
JTG

[JTG]

Here are a couple more. Notice the pail of mastic and look at the size of trowel the poor fellow was told to use and the second picture is the floor after the tile were pulled up. Look how much they had slid around, size of the joints etc.

[dbol]

Hey what a great shower, I especially like the built in towel holder. I wonder if they could have made a corner shelf out of that copper. Once it ages abit it will really go with that tile.

[stonemason777]

Hey, is that a brick joint? :shake:

[Trask]

This is the first in a string of shower faliures from the same guy. He has a great M.O. Always plugs weapholes with mortar..drypack is done with mortar mix. Nails through top of curb..a few times inside curb. And makes bench seats out of wood only covered with 15lb. felt and cbu.

See the roofing nail. Daily shower lasted 2 years in a doctors home.

[Trask]

I just found this one I had forgotten about. Exterior deck on the coast..OVER living space...NO membrane. The tile guy also was good enough to "fix " the flashing detail for the home owner. It leaked befor the job was competed, The tile guy told the homeowner it was because it had not been grouted or sealed. He then skipped off in to the sunset.
Note the silicone used to stick the hardi to the flashing :scratch:

Oh and it had a negative slope back to the house. The one missing tile had fallen off into the gutter on is own.

In the end we didn't get the job because we were too expensive.. and they did'nt want to tear into the framing :wtf:

[Tool Guy - Kg]

Normally this would be "before" picture. But since the lady in this house was using it AS IS for a couple years like this, and took the time to install the niche inna corner, I thought it would qualify for this thread. She wasn't a lick concerned about water going inna walls. You shoulda seen the wood structure in the basement. :eek:

[Trask]

OMG..that's unreal. A bucket :rofl:









..A bucket for god's sake

[jdm]

Last night HGTV reran a show called "Bad Baths".

Most notable was a shower floor where the "contractor" had installed those 1" back-beveled glass mosaics that are face-mounted on paper. Only he installed it paper side down. The homeowner could just pick up the tiles off the floor.

[Trask]

Heard of a swimming pool done like that too :D

[jdm]

Trask --

That deck you posted is very similar to how I would someday like to add a deck off my master bedroom. Where would one find the detailing on how to do it correctly?

[opiethetileman]

Jeff go to Home depot Isle 12 they will help ya LOL just kidding. I am sure schuletr men would have the answers

[Trask]

The biggest problem, aside from the lack of membrane and proper install practices, ect. is where the roof valley line intersects the tile deck. There's no way I could see to make that junction work. And ya, look at Schluters deck details..that's the way to go. I think the key is to use the whole system...gutters and all. That way there's no chance other trades can make penetraions where they shouldn't.

[jdm]

Trask --

Thanks. That valley is the one part I don't have.

Opie --

Home Despot would probably have me put down a skim coat of mastic as a waterproofing layer. I'll pass on their advice.

[jspinoza]

the problem with some contractors (a small percentage I hope) is they sell the job, then pay someone with no experience $10 an hour to mess it up. when this guy got kicked off, I was called to fix it. I took pic's before and after.

[jspinoza]

he was so happy he called me back to do another upstairs, on it right now

[Trask]

Jake,

Good to see the tile guy can play the hero as well as the villian..way to be the hero man! :) Looks nice. That old wall looks like a greenboard/mastic job.

[Rd Tile]

Ohhh, those soap dishes. :complain:

[Richard Tunison]

Very nice Jake!!

[Richard Tunison]

J.D., I dislike those things also. Cheesey, misshapen, etc. but I have to install alot of them. I usually end up with my 4" grinder to hawg some of the stuff off of the back and sides of the casting to make it fit. I've had to replace one that the plumber dropped the shower head on that was set with good thinset. Not fun or good for the kerdi. Then their is the question with the homeowners/contractor about which side to put "up". The soap thingy side or the flat side.

They should all go with a beautiful niche.....

[John Bridge]

I'm with you on the niche, Richard. I try to sell them every time and usually succeed. :)

Didn't take any pics of the shower I'm working on now. Tore it out a couple days ago. It's for a customer who couldn't wait for me last year. When he called me this year he said he'd wait. :)

Lemme see, Hardibacker nailed directly over greenboard, no barrier. Greenboard installed inside shower pan right down to the subfloor. Nails and screws everywhere including about an inch off the subfloor right through the shower pan liner. Mastic on the walls -- re-emulsified near the bottom of the shower -- very nasty when you get it on your hands.

The plumber in this case had done a stupendous job of installing the shower pan, pre-slope and all. Tile guy screwed it up. The whole thing was solid mold about three feet up the walls. In place for less than a year.

[jspinoza]

yes in retrospect the dishes are hideous. good thing is I can bust em out and put in something else right? :scratch: I was inspired by the niches I saw here, namely John Bridges. So The surround I'm building now (in the same house) has a wonderful 18"x38" niche with three marble shelves. came out very nice I think. I'll post pic's soon in my "waterproofing shower" thread. the guy's real cool, so I "forgot" to charge extra for this custom work. when I'm done I plan to ask y'alls professional opinion as to what you might charge for a similar bathroom remodel, so I can be better compensated in the future. different thread, no shame in that game :yipee:

[justin savage]

Here is a general contractors handywork. justin

[scott anthony]

There not soap dishes there handle bars :D

[Rd Tile]

At least he taped the drain. :D

[Dave Taylor]

This URL links to a thread posted by Bob Zschoche a while back. The thread rightfully takes it place here as "The Wall of Shame". :think:

http://johnbridge.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=29711&page=1&pp=15&highlight=brick+wall

[Trask]

Woa! That's bad Brick buldge.

here my new one of the week. Same tile guy different house. This one lasted almost three years. Same trademark move, nails throught the curb top, right under the shower door which did a nice job of channeling water right to the nail holes in the membrane and down to the floor. The bath floor also had tar paper instead of thinset under the wonderboard. That did a nice job of holding the water against the OSB long enough to mold and rot out the top flange of the TGI's

[jspinoza]

Ok, thinset under the backerboard, got that. But thinsets not a water shield correct? Thats why when I prepped the bathroom Im remodeling now with the watertite membrane, I continued out of the shower and sealed the entire bathroom floor, going up the walls about 5 inches. The only way water can leave this room is by going out the door! then what... :scratch:
ok and one more thing bothering me. I membrane the tub surround walls, and put a nice fat joint of caulk between the backer and the tub. After I tile, I put another bead of caulk between the botom row and the tub. Now when the water pentrates the grout and gets behind the tiles and starts to seep down, its going to be trapped, only way out is to weep back through the grout, providing a constant source of moisture for that ugly black stuff. :crap: Should I even care about that? am I over thinking this whole thing, or are we still facing a problem and awaiting the technology to fix it? What we need there is a flexible AND semipermeable grout, or some weep holes.

[scott anthony]

We had someone who I haven't from in a coons age Maja mud. He started something similar, take a peek. If It comes up like I hope.


http://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=5985&highlight=jackleg+files

[jspinoza]

The job was terrible, but when I started the tearout, and the sill came up with two fingers, I had to gasp. :wtf:

[Hamilton]

Jake i think i would have held my breath, that curb looks pretty nasty :sick:

[bobturner]

here is one. can you tell me whats wrong with this picture?
http://img448.imageshack.us/img448/5737/hpim01452qz.th.jpg (http://img448.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hpim01452qz.jpg)

[cx]

can you tell me whats wrong with this picture? Mmmm. It's way to small to see and it gots a Homer bucket in it? :D

[muskymike]

Looks like some one missed the toilet. :lol2:

[scott anthony]

Double click the pic and it will grow:)
Other than no tape I don't know. Is that a gas line?

[cx]

Oh, kewl! I forget some peoples actually know how to use this website. :D

I give up. Maybe it was s'posta be a gas line and water came out instead?

Maybe somebody spilt the Homer bucket?

Maybe Homer hisownself was doin' the job?

Maybe the handle's on the wrong direction on the trowel?

Maybe there's s'posta be a terlit hole there and there ain't one?

Hell, I dunno, Bob. What's wrong with the picher? :scratch:

[Autoplay]

I know I know!!!! They used Magnesiacore over 16" joists. Suppose to be over joists 2"s on center/grin

[opiethetileman]

they put the hardi wrong side down. I will crawl under the house and look. Or its my dried up blood

[Trask]

That was agood one Rich :rofl:

Did they just forget the toilet hole? What the deal? :scratch:

[Zaritile]

Rich you need more ammo=== MAgnoscore must be tripple laminated to itself with car body bondo for a 3 million psi rating under Hardi :D

[bobturner]

Upside down, no joint tape, water heater in the closet leaking like heck, and to top it all off, sheetrock screws holding down the hardi which was just installed dry. I could pick the tiles up clean thinset and all.

[cx]

Now just how the hell you 'spect us to tell all that from that picher? :scratch:

I mean, really, you can tell that water done came outa a leaky water heater from over here, Bob? :rolleyes:

I still say the biggest problem is that bucket. :D

[Trask]

Oh wow..ALL OF THE ABOVE. That could be a demo on What not to do :tup2:

[bobturner]

I have a no homer bucket policy. That is unless I forget my nifty pickle buckets, and need one real bad. Buckets and tape measures man. I got to hide them everywhere.

[jdm]

So, if you're in a pickle you'll use a Homer bucket, but otherwise you'll use a pickle bucket?

[bobturner]

Thats good. I have to remember that one

[scott anthony]

Hey can you guess whats wrong here :yeah:

[scott anthony]

No really heres one I did. The pan held water all right. No weep hole flow here. Every thing that could be wrong was.
What you see is black water funk almost exceeding the liner, yummy.

[bobturner]

I looked at this one the other day. The installers didn't moisture test, and installed over gypsum leveler below grade in a mall. They kept asking me to patch it up. I told them it was a total loss. Never heard back. Notice the pin nails in the volcano. Didn't even use the right fasteners.


(http://img300.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hpim00121wh.jpg)

[IMG]http://img268.imageshack.us/img268/9329/hpim00108nn.th.jpg (http://img268.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hpim00108nn.jpg)

http://img268.imageshack.us/img268/2646/hpim00141rb.th.jpg (http://img268.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hpim00141rb.jpg)

[flatfloor]

While I’m poking at my keyboard the TV is on, one of those Judge Shows. My ears perk up when I hear the defendant is a tile contractor . v Mr. And Mrs Homeowner.

Mr & Mrs are suing John Crew of Crew’s Crew. I think this occurred in Florida. They are suing for $2,700, cost of the job. I don’t know how many SF. Anyhow they had pictures showing voids in the grout, cracked tiles, lippage, tiles going round door jambs and loose tiles. She also claims hollow spots and creaking.

The tiles were laid on plywood, BUT at the direction of the homeowners son he first installed wire mesh. The son is a “pool contractor” somehow I got the sense he’s probably a helper of some sort. J crew says he never uses mesh just installs the thinset directly on the ply. Says the mesh was half stapled and half nailed down. The son ran out of staples so the finished it with nails The description leads me to believe it was chicken wire. It took a fair amount of questioning to get the owners to admit the son was there.

No discussion of supporting structure, both parties were hiding bits and pieces. J Crew said he knew the mesh would cause problems but did it at there insistence. He also admitted the floor does creak.

Anyhow da judge told him if he knew it was wrong he shouldn’t have done it and awarded the owners $1,500. They said they are going to use the money to fix problem areas. :rolleyes:

[jspinoza]

I see a leaking toilet valve and a toilet flange that has been covered by Hardiboard.

[John Corley]

The homeowners paid the guy up front ......

This is what they got.

I have been hired to tear it out and make all better. I can't believe some guys out there. If I saw this guy I think I might kick his a$$ for screwing over nice people. :shake:

[lou432]

Good God!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! John! Thats hardly believable! When you tear it out I`d be interested to see what under it? It prolly looks worse!

[John Corley]

Don't worry guys, I'm bringing my camera!

[Tool Guy - Kg]

Well,

At least it's all horrible and the homeowners want it ALL torn out. I'd hate to be on the end of trying to salvage any of that craptacular artwork.

:)

[muskymike]

Wow, that's bad! :shake:

[Hamilton]

I have a shower pan repair to do soon. Was supposed to be a walk in
shower.... showroom worthy. Homeowner turned the shower on to warm
it up, went to the laundry room to grab a fresh towel. When he got back
the entire bathroom was flooded. Has a sweeping shower door that goes
in and out of the shower. Well to fix the problem the owner of the company
himself used mastic to stick down some 2x2 mesh mounted stone. To create
a curb he just buckled the tile in front of the glass door. Stay tuned for
pics.

[opiethetileman]

John that shower looks fine make yourself another glass of rum and coke and a BIG shot of tequlia looks fine to me. Almost looks like a ride at a musement park int here. Did they tell you how much the invested in that casket already????

[John Corley]

They paid him $2,100 and bought all materials including some tools...

[dgunnels]

That's a shame. The stone looks really pretty. What a waste.

[EEEO]

You mean it's not supposed to look like that? :uhh:

This is probably one of my favorite threads. :lol1:

[Trask]

You'd almost have to try to do something that bad :rolleyes:

[lou432]

I don`t know??? I don`t think I could ever TRY anything that hard .
I think I`d have to Blind :loaded: .

[jdm]

Even the tilework at the Home Despot "classes" comes out better than that.

[EEEO]

I've never gone to one nor have I seen the results.......but I'd like to :yeah:

[dgunnels]

Now to be fair, I attended a tiling class at the Despot a coupla years ago. The guy was spot on about how to spread the 'mastic' but other than that it was useless. Thank goodness I had the sense to do more research than that. I do have to comment that even my pathetic first attempt in that class was better than that.

[Trask]

My wife pulled me out of one of those HD classes once. I was apparently embarassing her...I tried to explain that it was like driving away from a school bus wreck on the side of the road where help had not yet arrived..."Those people need me"..I told her..."They need my help"....she said something about me walking home and I agreed they would probably be alright this time...but I'll be back someday.




...And I'll have my TYW super hero uniform on under my clothes :dunce:

[Hamilton]

Awwww cmon.... its a great course if you want to learn how
to tile a 12x12 piece of superfabulousboard with 9 4x4 tiles :p

[John Corley]

ok

pictures coming soon but I gotta tell everybody how this is working out.

the wall was hardibacker behind that was green board behind that was tar paper.

This guy actually used form boards and poured the curb and pan with concrete.

Drain was way to high, no water proofing in pan.

[Hamilton]

At least you all had curbs. Take a gander at this set of pics. Yes the white
substance you see is indeed mastic almost 1.5" thick. :x:
The owner had this shower built brand new. When the first attempt
to build a walk in shower failed someone figured out how to fix it. Originally
the bathroom flooded within seconds as everything sloped away from the
drain. Instead of even testing this "Fix" the owner tossed the installer.

[Hamilton]

...... I know you want more... .. . :sick:

[opiethetileman]

nice shower ya built there jack. what ups with the seat is that a green house.

[John Corley]

I'm always amazed at what the hacks come up with next!


:jack: will make it right!

[flatfloor]

Unbelievable! :shake:

[Rd Tile]

Looks like the surface of the moon, yes, I've been there. :D

[scott anthony]

How do people let these idiots finish the job? The last two jobs should be a criminal offence. unbelievable.

[muskymike]

Wow! :shake: :sick:

[John K]

Speechless! :x: :eek: :eek:

[Theold--scottyb]

Well atleast the diagonal in the corner lined up... :eek:

Jack, can I steal those pics?

[Hamilton]

Sure Scotty. I cant imagine what you want to do with em :scratch:
The horror gets worse. I didnt get pics but as i removed the bottom
couple courses of diagonals i was able to get a view of the verticle
corners. I found 1/2" gaps in the wonderboard that werent sealed in
any way. the wonderboard was coverd in redguard but the corners
werent taped or waterproofed and the gaps were HUGE.

[Theold--scottyb]

Selling tool.. :yipee:

[Tool Guy - Kg]

"Yes, Mr. Johnson, here are some pichers of what my work looks like....." :tup1:


"....and here's a couple pichers of what you'll get should you go with what I'll lightheartedly call my competition." :eek:

[Theold--scottyb]

Right on..

[Jerry L A Tile]

Well atleast the diagonal in the corner lined up... :lol1:

So Jack, After the shock wore off I bet you wanted to bust out laughing when you saw this. :D I'm glad you decided to enjoy the moment with us. :twitch: You know, if jobs like these didn't exist guys like ya'll wouldn't look so good. :yeah: You know, like if you didn't have evil then you wouldn't know what good was. Those pictures are probably gonna be as good a marketing tool as all the excellent work you do. :yeah:

[Hamilton]

I feel horrible for my customers i really do. None of this is good. Its
a brand new shower. If i never have to use these pics i wont bother.
If im challenged on the subject of mastic or what a cheap price gets
you, well at least ill have proof. For now the photos will serve the purpose
of documentation of what really existed as this may be a job that winds
up in a courthouse. I found out this eve the entire shower will be redone.
Ill be taking pics along the way for my customer to use as evidence
if it all comes down to a legal battle.

[jjwq8]

Where was the supervision?

[opiethetileman]

supervision?? he couldnt leave the tile class at home depot. his shift was from 10 am to 8 pm.

[Hamilton]

Not sure i made this clear so i will now. I dont have any employees
and i didnt install this project. I am tearing it out and rebuilding it. ;)

[opiethetileman]

Jack u have 2 employess they are righty and lefty the only 2 who show up everyday.

[Big AL]

What's funny to me about dat one is the nice glass door.
What must the glass guy have been thinking trying to put that door in? It would be like installing a new windshield on a wrecked Chevy! :lol2:

Can you re-use it?

[Hamilton]

Well i mentioned in my first post the original shower floor was designed to
be a walk in. The pics i posted are an attempt to fix what didnt work.
The slope to the drain went up instead of down when they tiled the floor
the first time. To fix it the genius who masterminded this took up tiles
here and there randomly, I never did figure out why... and then proceeded
to float the floor with mastic. Eh well. What started out as a pan repair
has turned into a complete tear out and redo.

As i finished removing the shower floor tile and a couple courses of wall
tile at the bottom of the walls i noticed some troubles that concerned
me so i left a note for the owners to contact me when they returned home.

The back wall of the shower had been wonderboarded, sealed with redguard
and tiled before the right and left walls were even prepped. Let me say it
twice for you fast readers. They prepped the back wall and tiled it before
prepping the side walls. :stupid2:

Here are a few more pics. Notice how the tile is cut tight to the studs.
The 1/2" to 5/8" gap in the corner isnt helping in any way either.

[Hamilton]

Heres a couple slightly less technical offenses, but wrong the same.
Both of these pics are right side up. In this shower the leaves in
the listello dont nowhere near all go the same direction.
The pic with the small niche is the right wall and the other pic
is the back wall.

[GraniteGirl]

What a waste of some really, really nice materials.

How can folks spend that much on tile and mosaics and hire a total idiot to install it? That installer guy should be put out of everybody's misery http://vacuum-music.com/foruum/img/smilies/shoot.gif http://vacuum-music.com/foruum/img/smilies/diebadly.gif

[EEEO]

Was the mastic on the pan even close to dry? I can't imagine it would be. They probably could sell that method by advertising "a shower pan that conforms to fit your feet."

[Hamilton]

Eric the mastic was only dry in the grout joints. The mastic under
the tile was still fresh enough to stick to my skin and stick all over
my tools. I took most of the tile up with a margin trowel by simply
scooping and lifting.

[EEEO]

Blech. :sick: That sounds like JB's worst nightmare! :eek:

[Hamilton]

Well heres the pics of the shower rebuilt. I didn't bother taking shots
of the construction. You can check the liberry for those kinna pics :)
I put a preslope and 40mill pan in, centered the drain and raised the
valve. I moved the recessed niche to a location that would allow us
to build a bigger one. The last niche was only about 4"x8".The shower
walls got fresh greenboard with 15# felt,metal lathe and mud. Tile is
porcelain set with megalite.
The liner is natural stone and is the mesh mount type with itty bitty 1/8" & 1/4"
pieces packed together so tight there really isn't much you can do to straighten them.
Shower floor and bench are 2x2 tumbled travertine.

[ddmoit]

Awesome, Jack! It's really art, what you pros do.

[Big AL]

Beautyous Maximus!!!!
:clap2:

[Theold--scottyb]

:clap1: as always jack ole buddy.

[Ashvin]

I think you all are being too hard on the first guy. He should have been allowed to simply inject more mastic under the "curb" to get a higher lift. :gerg: Also I'm no pro but as I understand the gap and no waterproofing should not be a concern because his choice of tile and mastic as the only waterproofing material should be sufficent. :idea:

[flatfloor]

Hi Ashvin, could you be a bit more explicit please? I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. :)

[GraniteGirl]

Great job, Jack! :clap2: Were you able to save some of the original material or did the h/o have to pony up for another round of tile? I still can not believe the first guy did such a bad job with such nice materials.

Flat - I think (hope) Ashvin was being sarcastic in that post :jack:

[Tool Guy - Kg]

Jack,
This thread is reserved for hack-tack-u-lar work destined for the "Hall of Shame", not the "Hall of Fame". I know you started with mastic madness there, but this corrected work is too good for this thread....your kind isn't wanted here! :mad:




By the way, outstanding work! :nod:

[Jerry L A Tile]

Nice Jack :tup2: Love the corner. :clap2:

[John K]

Very nice Jack,

Is that a better bench? I like the deco. :clap1:

[opiethetileman]

Jack didnt do that his twin siter did. Jack installed the first one with mastic.

[customceramicsllc]

nice work jack! :cool:
after looking at these horror stories/pics it makes me wonder why us real tradesmen have no work from time to time.
nevertheless i will hold my head up high and persevere.