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Bud Cline
08-12-2001, 08:05 PM
Hotel Especen; Hanoi-Vietnam :: 7 APR 95, 1911 hours:

The following public domain information is a transcript from the US Congress House Committee on Internal Security, Travel to Hostile Areas, HR 16742, 19-25 September, 1972, page 7671.

[Radio Hanoi attributes talk on DRV visit to Jane Fonda; from Hanoi in English to American servicemen involved in the Indochina War, 1 PM GMT, 22 August 1972

Text: Here's Jane Fonda telling her impressions at the end of her visit to the Democratic Republic of Vietnam;

This is Jane Fonda. During my two week visit in the Democratic Republic of Vietnam, I've had the opportunity to visit a great many places and speak to a large number of people from all walks of life--workers, peasants, students, artists and dancers, historians, journalists, film actresses, soldiers, militia girls, members of the women's union, writers.
I visited the (Dam Xuac) agricultural coop, where the silk worms are also raised and thread is made. I visited a textile factory, a kindergarten in Hanoi. The beautiful Temple of Literature was where I saw traditional dances and heard songs of resistance. I also saw unforgettable ballet about the guerrillas training bees in the south to attack enemy soldiers. The bees were danced by women, and they did their job well.

In the shadow of the Temple of Literature I saw Vietnamese actors and actresses perform the second act of Arthur Miller's play All My Sons, and this was very moving to me--the fact that artists here are translating and performing American plays while US imperialists are bombing their country.

I cherish the memory of the blushing militia girls on the roof of their factory, encouraging one of their sisters as she sang a song praising the blue sky of Vietnam--these women, who are so gentle and poetic, whose voices are so beautiful, but who, when American planes are bombing their city, become such good fighters.

I cherish the way a farmer evacuated from Hanoi, without hesitation, offered me, an American, their best individual bomb shelter while US bombs fell near by. The daughter and I, in fact, shared the shelter wrapped in each others arms, cheek against cheek. It was on the road back from Nam Dinh, where I had witnessed the systematic destruction of civilian targets-schools, hospitals, pagodas, the factories, houses, and the dike system.

As I left the United States two weeks ago, Nixon was again telling the American people that he was winding down the war, but in the rubble-strewn streets of Nam Dinh, his words echoed with sinister (words indistinct) of a true killer. And like the young Vietnamese woman I held in my arms clinging to me tightly--and I pressed my cheek against hers--I thought, this is a war against Vietnam perhaps, but the tragedy is America's.

One thing that I have learned beyond a shadow of a doubt since I've been in this country is that Nixon will never be able to break the spirit of these people; he'll never be able to turn Vietnam, north and south, into a neo-colony of the United States by bombing, by invading, by attacking in any way. One has only to go into the countryside and listen to the peasants describe the lives they led before the revolution to understand why every bomb that is dropped only strengthens their determination to resist.

I've spoken to many peasants who talked about the days when their parents had to sell themselves to landlords as virtually slaves, when there were very few schools and much illiteracy, inadequate medical care, when they were not masters of their own lives.

But now, despite the bombs, despite the crimes being created--being committed against them by Richard Nixon, these people own their own land, build their own schools--the children learning, literacy--illiteracy is being wiped out, there is no more prostitution as there was during the time when this was a French colony. In other words, the people have taken power into their own hands, and they are controlling their own lives.

And after 4,000 years of struggling against nature and foreign invaders--and the last 25 years, prior to the revolution, of struggling against French colonialism--I don't think that the people of Vietnam are about to compromise in any way, shape or form about the freedom and independence of their country, and I think Richard Nixon would do well to read Vietnamese history, particularly their poetry, and particularly the poetry written by Ho Chi Minh.

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Rob Z
08-12-2001, 09:08 PM
I have a lot to say about that woman, none of it good and some of it criminal. I'll leave it all unsaid on this forum.

JC
08-12-2001, 09:23 PM
Im not touching it either but the word treason is probably most fitting word I can think of.

They used to kill people for that.

Just think of how much harm that did to the soldiers fighting for this country!

Bud Cline
08-12-2001, 09:39 PM
Here's some more stuff on America's best known communist Hanoi Jane.

This is very wordy but interesting.

http://www.usvetdsp.com/story8.htm

JC
08-12-2001, 09:49 PM
Wow, that is wordy I am going to have to read it tommorow when I have more time.

I do like the part that says "today she is a very rich capitalist" hehe

I will say one thing for her she looked damn good in Barberella though..Thats the only good thing I can say about her.

rickbuddy
08-17-2001, 09:18 AM
Every time I read about Nike shoe company paying Vietnamese workers 10-cents a day for their labors, I think, "How about that, we finally did win that war."

Rick

cx
08-17-2001, 09:34 AM
Rick:
What's the source of the quote you use for your signature?

I want to send it to my Libertarian Party web site and I'd like to give proper credit.

CX

rickbuddy
08-17-2001, 10:53 AM
I'm glad you like it.

I wrote it.

Really would have loved to get it to Bill Maher for Politically Incorrect.

Credit away, "Rick Bauer, Writer/Comedian"

Rick

John Bridge
08-17-2001, 07:08 PM
Well, this is really great, guys. You've really lifted me up and made my day. Since we're here, though . . . .

In retrospect (20/20) I think Jane Fonda did what her conscience and feeble mind told her to do. I hated her for years, but I don't anymore. Had she had a lick of sense she never would have fallen for that crap, but she didn't and she did. Leave her alone. Recently, she partially recanted those remarks of over a quarter century ago, and if I'm not mistaken, she even apologized to the POWs.

Here's the thing. Nixon WAS an asshole. I voted for him twice. He let me down.

Politics, that's all. Politicians are pricks.

But even knowing what a complete disaster the Vietnam (Viet Nam in those days) debacle was, I to this day think we went there to try to do some good. I have to believe that, folks.

Dave Ashton
08-17-2001, 08:13 PM
John:

Ive sat on barstools, park benches, edges of hospital beds, flown in airplanes (and not landed), with alot of veterans. Having fought in two foreign "wars", my hat goes off to you. I put "wars" in quotes because in my opinion they dont have much of a comparison to Viet Nam. Both times we had the whole world (almost) on our side; backing us up, sending support. You and your fellow mud soldiers perservered without much, if any, of that. What you did for us was more than good, it was heroic. And yes, I do mean "us" because "us" is what makes our country..the Jane Fondas included.

God Bless America!

Dave

John Bridge
08-17-2001, 09:05 PM
Hear, hear, Dave.

But I mentioned earlier, maybe in another post, that I was the ultimate in rear echelon type dudes. I was the personnel sergeant of an infantry brigade, but I was not infantryman.

I never jumped out of aircraft until they were on the ground.

I stayed blitzed most of the time I was in-country.

My fondest recollection of the Viet Nam War: "Hey, what do you mean we don't get Sundays off?"

cx
08-17-2001, 10:20 PM
I want to believe we got into that nightmare called Viet Nam (yeah, I still spell it that way too) for purposes good and honorable, but I can't. Maybe way back with Ike, and even JFK - maybe. Ike didn't know any other way to conduct foreign policy but with the military, I suppose. Kenedy just didn't know what was going on over there, I don't think. But by the time Nixon (I never voted for him) had run it for a while, I think there was no question it was being escalated for reasons entirely driven by the military/industrial complex that even Eisenhower warned against. And it just became more of an obscenity after that. And our fearless leaders never even had the balls to declare it a war. Too much liability for the damage to the cannon fodder if they did that.

Took me a number of years after narrowly excaping the actual horrors of the place to recognize what was really going on over there. I was even farther to the rear than John, but, as previously admitted, young and stupid enough to want to get into the real action. Now I recognize that the only guys with real juevos were the ones who recognized it for what it really was and said, "hell no, I won't go". I would never have had the courage then.

As for Hanoi Jane? I always thought she went too far with the actual undermining of the grunts in the mud, but she was on the right side of the argument as far as us having no business over there. Her right to be as vocal and obnoxious as she wants in the excercise of free speach is what we ARE supposed to be willing to fight for - and I remain so.

Now, can we talk about something else? Not that I've ever been sensitive about that issue mind you. Probably the only reason I kept any sanity was that I was assigned to saving people's lives and property during my time as "Viet Nam Era Veteran" and could be proud of all five years. And the only times I ever jumped out of airplanes was to get in the water and drag somebody out.

Well, there was that one other time - but actually I was pushed. Much lighter topic.

flatfloor
08-18-2001, 06:06 PM
"My country right or wrong"

Anybody know who said the following?
"Beware of entangling foreign alliances"

cx
08-18-2001, 06:35 PM
I'm guessing T.J.

flatfloor
08-18-2001, 07:22 PM
Close, it was G.W. in his farewll address. I guess we don't listen too well, and that's why 90% of the world is mad at us and the other 10% are trying to screw us.

cx
08-18-2001, 07:58 PM
Knew it was one of them Fathers. Ol' George had a pretty good head on him, too.

You sure you got them percentages right? Not questioning the mad so much as the trying to screw. Think it's a bit low, and think they probably overlap substantially.

And we keep making the same mistakes over and over and over in our foreign policy - if, indeed, we can be said to actually have a foreign policy.