Botched tile installation - need help

[JoannaNC]

Hi, I'm new. First post. My name's Joanna and we just moved into our new home in NC. The GC hired incompetent and/or inexperienced subs and we have lots of problems. Most of them are being addressed one by one, but I am certain that the GC will not ever agree to fix our shower tile because it's 'cosmetic' so I'm hoping someone has a DIY suggestion for us.

The installer used the wrong color of grout on our shower tile (4x4 unpolished travertine) and now it has a gray cast that makes it look perpetually dirty. The photo shows the way it looks and the way it's supposed to look (see 4 uninstalled tiles on the right side.) Notice how much darker the installed tile is.

Is there anything we can do to lighten up the tile?

http://www.kodakgallery.com/BrowsePhotos.jsp?&collid=348712406205&page=1&sort_order=0

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[Davestone]

Joanna, i'm afraid that's the body of the stone.In any run of stones there are darks and lights, and i'm afraid you have a lot of the darker ones.You can try cleaning it well,that may help a little,but other than replacing them, i don't think yoo can lighten them. :bow: :)

[GraniteGirl]

Have to concur with Dave on this one. The way it looks on the picture, the tiles that were installed were that color to begin with. It happens in travertine and unless you inspected the tiles before installation and told the GC or setter that you did not like those tiles, nobody is at fault for using them.

Sorry if this was not the advice you would have liked. It is the nature of natural stone to be - well... natural. Color variations happen.

You might want to consider using a non-acidic stone specific cleaner to see if you could remove any residual grout haze.

How big is that grout line and what did they use for grout? Is that the shower floor?

[doitright]

Hi Joanna, Welcome!

I see lots of excess grout as you mention. There are also light and dark shades of stone, but that's not what I hear your concern is.

It's difficult to remove grout without using something acidic (which would damage your stone). Are there any grout clumps, or is the floor smooth?

If you have access to HG products, I believe they have a product that may help safely remove this grout. If not, sometimes a concentrated (undiluted) stone & tile neutral pH cleaner may help.

[JoannaNC]

Thank you. What is 'HG?' Is that a brand name? Is it something I can order on the web?

Since I'm not happy with the tile anyway, would it matter if I used Shower Fresh on it every day? It's so rough looking I can't imagine the chemicals making it look any worse than it does. What exactly is the 'damage' these products cause?

[GraniteGirl]

Any harsh cleaner not specifically for stone will damage and degrade the stone and whatever sealer you had applied to protect it. It might not be immediately apparant because of the texture of the stone, but in the long run it is bound to cause you untold headaches.

[Davestone]

Yes, i've seen Jerusalem stone...a hard stone..fall apart, crumble, and disintegrate just from window cleaner sprayed on the shower doors. :bow: :)

[doitright]

Hi Joanna :)

HG was available on the east coast. I see only select products are available on the web. I'm trying to research exactly which product you need. Currently it's not coming up.

As Dave and Adrianna pointed out, you don't want to just use anything, as you can damage your floors beyond repair. :eek:

[JoannaNC]

Okay, I'm convinced. I won't use Tilex! :D
I have used a diluted solution of detergent becuase I didn't have anything else. I can't imagine using some kind of spray with a sponge because this shower is so huge! (11 x 6). I have to be able to use a mop.

[JoannaNC]

I called an experienced stone and marble installer today and he suggested sulfamic acid "follow the directions exactly."

[doitright]

Hi Joanna :)

Since he (your stone expert) recommended using sulfamic acid (one of the safer acidic products), see if he will come out and use it. This way if the floor is damaged, he will replace it.

If you're willing to do some TEST's, go in an inconspicuous area and try it. Vinegar and water (50/50) will produce about the same results. You can actually try it on one of your extra tiles first, to see how much etching will take place. You'll have to hold the tile up to a light at an angle to notice if there is any sheen difference (after the stone is dry).

[JoannaNC]

Our tile has no sheen. It's unpolished. I think a lot of damage would have to occur for me to notice any difference.

[doitright]

Hi Joanna :)

Believe me, I understand. Do a TEST first. :nod:

[JoannaNC]

Well... i did a test in a corner. No effect at all. Then I expanded the test area. Nothing. Finally I dumped the whole bucket in the shower and waited. Still nothing. It looks exactly like it did before.

The guy who suggested the acid is stopping by tomorrow to take a look.

[doitright]

Hi Joanna :)

I'm glad the "pro" is coming tomorrow.

What did you test with? :shades:

[Bill Vincent]

I "spoke" with Joanna in another forum about this, and I'll say here what I said there-- being that this is tumbled stone, you're not going to ruin the finish by using acid. What I suggested is that she find a PRO to clean it using muriatic acid in a light solution (especially seeing as how the sulfamic acid did practically nothing). I've done this before with tumbled stone and no adverse effects. I wouldn't recommend this as a DIY project, but for someone who knows what he's doing, it can be done safely.

[doitright]

Hi Bill :)

What you & I can do is one thing, but in the hands of the inexperienced is another. Same with alleged professionals. Over the years, I have learned not to use muriatic acid on anything. There are much safer detergent (acid blends) available.

If you took a look at the pics, I'm sure you wouldn't leave a floor looking like that either. :eek:

Yeah, muriactic will fix this one, but I'll guarantee it will dimple the floor. In my honest opinion, that's damageing the floor.

[Bill Vincent]

John-- If done by someone who doesn't know what they're doing, I agree, and that's not the worst that could happen, which is why I've stressed that it be done by a pro. I've acid washed tumbled marble before with good results. It's not something I like to do, or even recommend doing unless there's no other alternative, but in this case, I don't see any, especially seeing as how she's tried the sulfamic acid and it had almost no effect.

[doitright]

Hi Bill :)

Agreed! :nod:

She still didn't state what she specifically tested with. There sometimes is a huge difference between 50/50 vinegar and straight vinegar.

Hopefully Joanna will give us some more details today.

[Bill Vincent]

She did over here:

http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/load/build/msg0717284014058.html?37

[doitright]

Thanks Bill :)

What a thread! :eek:

[Steven Hauser]

Hi Joanna,

The pall is created by the grout color. The resulting repair is quite tedious.

If you don't like it I suggest ripping it out and starting over.

The grout is in the cevices and wide joints were used. It would be nearly impossible to get the look you want without risking severe damage to the tiles and installation.

Sorry but the sooner it is done the sooner it is over.

My .02