View Full Version : How much do you charge
For something small like this. Curious
Ditra/kerdi walls..just basic tub not including the floor
Don't mention the lack of access..Me and the Plumber have been telling these builders to use them but they seem to have another threory.oh well
http://bal.ifloor.com/files/45/d12.jpg
http://bal.ifloor.com/files/45/d10.jpg
http://bal.ifloor.com/files/45/d11.jpg
http://bal.ifloor.com/files/45/d13.jpg
And yes that is color matched grout...don't ask me but I never have any luck with Customs grout and color..(am open to advise on that subject)
sorry about the crappy photos..still trying to figure this camera out...I guess not using the flash in broad daylight would be a good start..eh?
Bud Cline
05-14-2002, 10:52 PM
JC,
Use your flash for "fill light" to eliminate the shadows.
If you can move down 1 or 2 f-stops to adjust for over exposure. Unfortunately todays cameras don't offer the opportunity to force the sometimes necessary adjustments you would like. Some rectal orifices somewhere think they have all this figured out with automatic this and automatic that.
Yea I was just playing around with that I did set the whatever's down a little lower to -0.5 and I will try it out tommorow (without the flash also) and see if that does it.
Does have a few adjustments I just discovered..new camera Digital 4.0 Kodak 4900...still learning.
Heres a link to some more fuzzy pictures of the house.
http://bal.ifloor.com/files/45/Gallery3.html
John Bridge
05-15-2002, 06:50 AM
Hey JC,
I've got plenty of capacity, but why don't you reduce those pics so they'll fit on the screen? You've got people scrolling up and down and back and forth. :D
Cami A
05-15-2002, 07:02 AM
For a free download, Irfanview (http://www.irfanview.com) has a lot of great features for transforming your photos...
I do like the Kodak cameras, just not the software for transferring the photos.
John Bridge
05-15-2002, 04:50 PM
I don't like the idea of having to set the camera in that other thing they sell just so you can upload.
Cami A
05-15-2002, 04:53 PM
You can upload without it. It's just "two-touch" instead of one... :D
John Bridge
05-15-2002, 05:24 PM
Oh, well I guess that's okay then. :)
Software does seem to suck.
Is this page too big?
http://bal.ifloor.com/files/45/Gallery2.html
Cami A
05-15-2002, 08:55 PM
Just over 4 minutes to load entirely. (56k dialup)
I dumped the Kodak software for the Camera/Scanner wizard that came with Windows XP. (yes, I know...booo, hissss- but it's really much more efficient.)
Should I divide that page in two pages then?
Ya know there was a question in this thread. I am curious becuase recently my charges were questioned and I just wanted to make sure I am in line with my prices..I did the tub for 700.00. Sound fair?
In answer to your original question, "How much do you charge?"
A dollar 2 98.
And not a penny less!!
Great work, but I would have used my "Brownie" with the flash cube.;)
Chippy
Cami A
05-16-2002, 06:11 AM
Two pages would be easier- maybe divide it into hardwood and tile?
Strictly non-pro opinion on the price- seems reasonable.
You're not some guy working out of his station wagon- you've got overhead to consider in addition to hourly wages. You've got to charge enough to stay in business, or you won't be around to honor any of your warranties. :)
Well this is for my favorite builder and I just want to be fair with him..I do all his work and he is very happy but I would hate for him to think I am "jacking" him.
He pays whatever I want so he would not say even if I was too high..
Now if this was for a once only customer off the street I would probably charge a 1000 for it. But then again those customers don't have the quantity of work.
What's included in that price JC? Is that just labour?...how many sq ft we talking here?
Just labor..Striaghten out the framing of the wooden deck (is there such a thing as a carpenter making a striaght deck?).
Then using installing Ditra on the deck and kerdi on the walls.
installing the tile...not sure of footage but just what you see.
Also had to miter all the corners.
I had a good couple days in it total(actual a little here and a little there). Thats kinda how I came up with that number.
So I guess no-one here does any jaccuzzi decks?
John Bridge
05-19-2002, 12:49 PM
JC,
I do 'em with mud and not with Kerdi, but $700 sounds about right.
Ok..Ok already.. I tell ya what ..if I get three legitimate responses to this thread..I will post a picture of myself saying thank you...how about it?
Dang that did'nt take long! Even before I was done posting.
How should I dress for the photo?
flatfloor
05-19-2002, 01:58 PM
As long as your not nekkid, this a cat/dog friendly site. :D
scotty B
06-05-2002, 09:50 PM
JC you are really charging $700 for that? I can only get around $150- $200 around here..
Harry
06-06-2002, 06:05 AM
Hi Scotty
Sounds like you're getting riped-off by some builders and/or retailers. Even builder prices should be up around $500.00 for this work.
Just the fact that JC straightened out the deck can add on $60.00 and then about another $150.00 (ballpark)to install the Ditra.
Harry
Paul D.
06-06-2002, 08:57 AM
JC,
Nice looking tub work. On the cost subject, FYI, a co-oworker had a master bath redone by a local tile setter (not a "remodeler" or general contractor type) and his 2-man crew. She said they charged $600 per day, plus material cost. They were mud-men and floated the floor, shower and tub surround prior to setting travertine throughout. $600 a day seemed pretty reasonable, considering it was on the 8th floor! :eek:
scotty B
06-06-2002, 02:22 PM
Harry that is why I will be opening my own showroom very soon. Hopefully by september. $200 is about tops around here. Now I can charge $700 but that is for a mud pan and then install tile all around. What do you guys charge for that?
Showroom? uh oh...you think your weren't making enough money before...uh oh....(just kidding;))
John Bridge
06-06-2002, 07:36 PM
Hi Scotty, Welcome to our little piece of heaven. :D
When you say "installer," what do you mean? What have you installed and how have you installed it. I ask this because you seem surprised by prices that I consider in line with what most pros charge.
And then you say you'll soon be a "retailer." Please fill us in on that a little, too.
John the Inquisitive :)
scotty B
06-07-2002, 05:23 AM
John, I have been installing for about 8 years, I install everything except carpet. I install for retailers for the most part, with 3 kids and a family its just easier to use retailers for work right now. If I contracted to a builder for their work outside of a store I might be able to charge that amount but working for retailers I cant, but soon will be. I already have my showroom location picked out and am getting ready for the racks. So yes I am a pro installer but just not using the right channels to command a higher price right now.. Just cant wait to be up and running:)
Bud Cline
06-07-2002, 02:59 PM
Hey Scotty....
...oh well nevermind, it's none of my business.
flatfloor
06-07-2002, 03:53 PM
Hi Scotty, way to go! Good Luck
SLC 4200
John Bridge
06-07-2002, 08:09 PM
Scotty,
JC (Computer Moderator) has recently become a retailer. Shoot him an email.
Dog Paws is also a retailer. Shoot him an email, too.
Harry used to be a retailer and I think maybe Bri was in there too. Don't email either of them. They'll talk you out of it. :D
I am still not yet a full fledged retailer..Some problems came up but they should be resolved now so I can proceed with the plan.
I have also been doing alot of thinking mostly about putting in 15 hour days for less money then I make now...yup thats kinda what I am expecting.
Also worried that I will not be able to trust any sub-contractor to do work for me since I am notoriously anal about quality..(or lack of it).
I do have a very experienced flooring salesman ready to go. I have been using him as a helper(overpaid at that..trying to help him pay his bills and keep him around) becuase due to some pretty messed up situation where he quit his job becuase well he was not getting paid and now is stuck(remember the ten grand I got ripped for,,this is that guys main salesman..haha..take that!). ..I am thinking to just make him a partner (shove him in the store)and stick to installing and let him do what he does best..selling.
As a partner he could take alot of the pressure off me.
I want the freedom of bieng a retailer and the rates ..but not the headaches. Think I would rather make less on the retail end in exchange for my sanity and the abilty to make more on the install end. Yet still have the option open.
flatfloor
06-07-2002, 09:13 PM
J.C. Penny (hmm J.C.-JC) made all his money with partners must have had a couple of hundred.
scotty B
06-09-2002, 05:46 PM
Been out of town riding 4-wheelers just got back.. Bud go ahead with your comment, I can take it :). Thanks John for the heads up on the emails. I hope to be up and running by september still working on my business plan, what a pain in the arse that is. I know there are headaches on both sides of the fence, what I am tired with is the buddie system and nepitism (sp). I will not kiss arse just to get work, I wont go out with the people I work for after hours for a beer or two, business and pleasure just dont mix. Thats why I am getting fed up with just installing. When I become a retailer I will sell and install. Mostly my wife will sell at first then we will hire a salesperson or two. I already have one lined up at his previous retailer he was averaging about $75,000 a month in sales. He is very good. My wife has an extensive background in retail she ran a store for a many years, it was a carpet one. So I should be good to go. Hopefully!!
Bud Cline
06-09-2002, 07:21 PM
I just don't know what makes you guys think by getting into and becomming a retailer you would automatically command a higher price for your services. Generally and across the board competition is competition. You'll no doubt get your share of the market but your getting that now.
Retailing may increase your exposure but of course will also increase your costs exponentially.
There is only so much of you to go around. It can be very difficult I would think. You probably already know that two guys can't do twice the work of one guy so your income can't double that easily.
I would think all that money would be better spent on promotion of what your doing now.
Yea I have to agree with you Bud , but why not..it is not as if I can install the rest of my life. If nothing else hopefully this could help with my future.
I already know what installing has to offer...work work and more work and no real future and it aint going to make me rich either.
Nothing ventured nothing gained...or lost for that matter. I will be on my knees for awile..but having a safty net can't hurt.
scotty B
06-10-2002, 05:22 AM
Bud I understand what you are saying, and have been thinking of the very same thing you said. but for some reason around here, for example, you cant really get into builder work without a store front, dont know why but that is the way it is. And like jc said I dont want to install for ever, I would like a little safety net my self when I decide to quit installing. Just standing on the fence post trying to decide which side to jump to..
Harry
06-15-2002, 06:49 AM
Well put Bud. My uncle told me when I was about 21 that success in any business depends on your ability to provide a good service with reliability and honesty.
Success at any venture can be measured by the amount of time left over at the end of the day for yourself and your family. It can be measured by the independence in which you make your decisions.
I believe that no matter what you do, if it's done better than the next guy does it .... you will rise to the top, whether it be retail or tile contracting. Financial success is the product of your money management skills, not your vocation.
Harry
John Bridge
06-15-2002, 07:11 AM
Very eloquent, Harry.
I'm over 60 and now you tell me. :D
BTW, your signature must be turned off.
scotty B
06-15-2002, 01:21 PM
Harry, I agree 100%. I tried the tile contracting route and it was a no go. People around here just want you to have a store front. I would much rather have a couple of good accounts to keep me busy and rent a warehouse to store goods than open a full blown retail, but I just cant get it to work. So in order for me to go after the "Big Boys" I need a store front, unless you guys know of another way to do it, if so than I am all ears...
stullis
06-16-2002, 10:11 AM
You don't necessarily have to have a store front but you do have to have access to the materials via accounts and some sample boards.
scotty B
06-16-2002, 08:12 PM
Stullis, The accounts are no problem, but where in the world do ya keep the sample boards, that normally take up 2500 square feet? And then do you install all day and try to sell at night? I would never be home with the family. So I guess its either install or retail..
flatfloor
06-17-2002, 12:43 PM
What about Prosource? That's more of a question than a suggestion.
scotty B
06-17-2002, 04:32 PM
Jim what do you mean, use them for my customers? How exactly does Prosource work? I either want to open retail or just get away from working for them. I cant stand all the bull that goes along with it. For example, I just installed 496' of pergo select planks with 6 steps. The job has 3 doorways with carpet. So I leave the usuall gap to drop the carpet reducer in. But I dont have any I have end caps.Call the head honcho and he wants me to "make them work" Needless to say he had to order carpet reducers. I am just tired of it and want to do it on my own, but cant figure out how unless you have a store front.. So what do you guys and gals think??
John Bridge
06-17-2002, 06:53 PM
Hell, seems like we're back to where we started.
I'm a successful independent, all-by-myself, don't take no . . . well, anyway. I don't have a store, and I don't carry samples around in the back of my truck. And I think I could do it in any state. That's ANY state, including Lon Gisland!
Thing is, you gotta specialize. You gotta be better at something than most of the others. That's really hard to do when you install everything that was ever made that will lay on a subfloor.
Maybe you do need a store. ;)
scotty B
06-17-2002, 07:14 PM
Alright John you are killing me...:) How did you get started? Do you do just tile? Believe me If I never did vinyl again I would be the happiest man alive. But sometimes the economy dictates what you get to install. I would be happy with installing tile wood and laminate. I have been installing for awhile now and I think I am one of the good ones around here. ( I didnt use best I am modest). I would just like to do my own thing. Do you advertise? Just trying to pick your brain alittle bit. Thanks for everyones advise and help, I am just teedering (sp) and I am not sure which way to go. Has anyone just put samples in a warehouse and did it that way? Wouldnt have the big overhead, and you could still take customers and builders to see samples? Just a thought..
flatfloor
06-17-2002, 08:13 PM
Scotty, as I understand it Prosource has showrooms all over and you can bring your customers in to their stores, you get a piece of the material sale and do your own thing as far as installation. I'm sure some of the others can fill you in much better than I.
John, you could make one hellava living here on LI.
John Bridge
06-18-2002, 07:20 PM
Scotty, I honestly don't mean to sound like the smart ass that I am, but when I started out, vinyl and other floorings weren't an option. The people I learned from didn't do anything but tile.
In fact, I don't call myself a floor layer. I do ceramic tile and marble. I build things -- showers, fountains, tub surrounds and decks, you name it. I build them out of cement mortar and bricks and blocks.
And then I cover them with tile. I "build" floors, too, and then I cover them with tile or stone.
It's a different business. It just happens that working on floors makes me quite a bit of money.
But I'm not a floor layer. :D
What I said was, you have to specialize. You have to hold yourself out as an expert at what you do. It's tough being an expert at a hundred different things. Just ask flatfloor! :D
flatfloor
06-18-2002, 07:40 PM
John, in your own inimitable style ;) you have stated my philosophy. Do something that not too many others do and do it better than those who do.
I am diverse myself. I thrive on new challenges. Without them I get bored easily.
If you are really good in one trade you will be good in another trade(with some training) simply becuase bieng good is a state of mind and it involves bieng a craftsman and caring about your work. Thats is 95% of bieng good. CARING about your workmanship!
If you care you will train yourself to be very good.
If John set his mind to do hardwood flooring he would be very good at it..why? becuase he is John Bridge thats why.
In this business you are either a True craftsman or your a shmuck..there is no middle ground.
You can always learn installion skills but you cannot be taught how to care.
I will take a guy who cares about his work with 2 years experience over a 20 year veteren with a burned out attitude anyday.
The human mind is very powerful and able to store and remember huge amounts of data..why can't one guy be good at more then one trade?
flatfloor
06-19-2002, 10:44 AM
Good points.
Bud Cline
06-19-2002, 03:40 PM
Ever so often JC comes across.
Like with the burning dog thing, still LMAO over that little ditty.
flatfloor
06-19-2002, 03:57 PM
Me too, gotta keep that going although John didn't seem to care for my tip. :D
John Bridge
06-19-2002, 06:45 PM
It's just that J.C.'s burning dog advice was memorable. ;)
J.C.,
I have done hardwood floors, and you know I'm a fair to midlin' carpenter and woodworker. I've done other things, too.
I am an "expert" tile setter and mason, though. There's a difference.
[Edited by John Bridge on 06-20-2002 at 08:04 AM]
scotty B
06-19-2002, 08:42 PM
I see where you guys are coming from. John I got started in floors through being a remodeler. I did everything from kitchens to decks, to cultured stone on the fronts of buildings, then I moved into flooring. When I was a helper and was learning the trade, if you didnt do "All" types of floors you set idle quite a bit, so I just learned to be diverse. I didnt set out to install every floor known to man that is just the way I was taught and that is the way retailers want installers around here. They dont seem to have any use for an installer that specializes in one floor. They want someone that they can give any job and they can get it done with out any compaints. Kinda sucks that way but I guess that is just the way it is around here..
stullis
06-20-2002, 06:26 AM
JC put it well. I feel it depends on the area you are doing business in and how much you want to travel. Large metro areas mean more customers in a locale. Easier to specialize and stay busy with higher end clients.
Now I live in a small town surrounded by small towns with clients who just can't afford ceramic. I refuse to give them a ceramic job at low prices just so I can stay busy just doing ceramic. Others do not and they just cut major corners to offer the customer ceramic jobs at cut rate prices so they can stay busy. All this does is reduce the "going rate". Big whoop! :mad:
ProSource can work for you if you happen to live close enough to one that you can bring in your customers. Their prices are so-so if you ask me. How are you going to compete when local stores retail their products for what you can buy them at from ProSource? Match price? Now you have just spent time selling and didn't make any thing. If you are going to sell you have to make something for your time. DON'T give it away like so many others out there.
Personally I would rather snap together click laminate in bedrooms then do ceramic tile..Let me see 2.59 -3.00 foot for laminate click together..can do an easy 4-500 feet a day..Many jobs are 600-1000 feet (since the trend is bedrooms and previous carpeted areas). Two days of that pays me about the same a 3-4 days of tile work. And laminate click together is mindless.
That is one reason I chose to be diverse..becuase the market changes and sometimes money is better somewhere else.
Now if I could be like John and do a complete mudded shower in a day and a half for 1500.00 that would be differant..but for me I need 3-4 and even 5 days for a mudded shower and I have to almost beg to get 1500 for them. Maybe one day.....
John Bridge
06-20-2002, 04:41 PM
Hey Scott,
What is that web site supposed to do?
J.C.,
I see your point, and I understand it. I know everybody can do it like I do. Hell, there's only so much room for prima donnas. :D
scotty B
06-20-2002, 06:31 PM
Who would of thought JC's post would be 4 pages long. On a side note how do you post pics on here. I have some tile pics I would like to post?
Scott T. hmmm S-c-o-t-t-T...Scotty..hmmm
Yea you sure you posted the correct web site?
Scott B. http://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin/index.php?action=bbcode
read this stuff.
scotty B
06-20-2002, 07:18 PM
Jc we are not the same person if that is what you are thinking. Its me Scott from flooring installer...(Mayfield hts ohio) Now do you remember? Thanks for the link I will try it and still wont be able to do it. :)
John Bridge
06-20-2002, 07:38 PM
Scott from Ohio. :)
Here's the specific part of the FAQ that tells you how to post images (if they have already been loaded to the Internet). http://johnbridge.com/vbulletin/index.php?action=bbcode
If they have not been, you can email them to me, but please reduce them so they'll easily fit on the reply form. Jpg, jpeg, gif. No bmp, tif, or any of the rest of that exotic stuff. :D
john@johnbridge.com
Or if you want to just post pics that are already on the internet (say from someone elses site ie.) Then just right click over the intended picture and press "copy image adress" or the equivelant of your browser. Then use the img tags as the link mentions and copy that address between them.
stullis
06-20-2002, 11:29 PM
If you want to know the details on the APP gas send me an email and I'll fill you in on the details. Bottomline you save money and I like that!
stullis@excite.com
Hmmm, I click on it and it goes right to the web page.
You guys are having problems with it?
I don't get a web page I get a full size pop up ad looking page..What gives.
Ok I give what is up with the APP gas? Details
scotty B
06-22-2002, 09:04 PM
John I think I will just email some to you and you can post them. Every time I try something new on this damn puter I want to throw it out the window.. Thanks for the offer. I will have to scan some, most of my tile pics were taken with a regular camera..
John Bridge
06-23-2002, 08:59 AM
Ok, Scotty, send 'em over. Please do me the favor of reducing the scans to a size that will fit here before you send them. Get them down to less than a hundred klicks -- something around a 4x6 or so.
stullis
06-24-2002, 10:57 PM
Membership allows you to purchase $200 Gas Cards for $160.
$40 savings per card and you can buy 15 cards in a year.
Ends up being a minimum savings of $305/ year.
The cards can be used anywhere you can use a MasterCard because it is a MasterCard!
There are other benefits as well but it is basically a no-brainer with the savings on the cards alone. Use them to buy gas, groceries, pay your bills, buy supplies, tools, whatever.
[Edited by stullis on 06-25-2002 at 01:02 AM]
hmmm I might just take another look at that site.
John you can always just shrink them using basic HTML , you know that trick?
scotty B
06-25-2002, 07:03 PM
Stullis how much is the membership?
stullis
06-26-2002, 06:29 AM
$600 savings on the cards alone minus $295 annual membership fee = $305 actual savings just using the cards.
I even got a membership for my wife so I could save an additional $305 per year. Wish I could buy more.
The Perks Club part gives you discounts on lots of other things as well. Haven't used those yet but I will. :)
Sonnie Layne
06-26-2002, 08:17 AM
I don't buy enough gas to bother. Nice thing about being in the middle of a big place, you get to pick your spots :)
I think I did read something about maintenance tho???
stullis
06-29-2002, 11:50 AM
Sonnie, they work ANYWHERE you can use a MasterCard!
I paid my cell phone bill with it, bought a couple of meals at a restaurant, bought some groceries at the local grocery store. And filled up with gas, bought some candy bars and 12 pack of Pepsi and my fishing license at the local SA station. And yes you can use it for oil changes and anything your local gas stations provide!
Heck, you could buy smokes and beer if the place takes MasterCard! :D
tileguytodd
06-29-2002, 04:31 PM
Ok lets see, 28,000 Miles per year/14 MPG =2000 Gals X an avg of 1.40=2,800.00 per year.Damn this is gettin complicated.Can we get back to fractions!!:D
Whats the % of savings Scott? If its what i think it is,we should prob discuss it over a 12 pack on a lake near a bar that has a happy hour,Oh yea and takes Mastercard :)
TODD
stullis
06-29-2002, 05:38 PM
That would be fine with me! Just got back from a mini-vacation and now I could use a vacation to recover from this one. :D
Percentage-wise it works out to a minimum 10.17% to 20% savings depending on how much you would use the rest of the perks. Dollarwise it amounts to a minimum $305 to $600 or more depending on how much you use the rest of the program.
I see they have a couple of 2 for 1 green fee deals on a couple of golf courses in Grand Rapids if you are a golfer. I'll check to see what else they have in your area.
tileguytodd
06-29-2002, 06:55 PM
Way cool Scott,Hmmm golfing now there s something i havent had time for in forever.......Do they still have a beer caddy running around on the course :)
stullis
06-29-2002, 07:14 PM
They do in my area! And they are usually very EZ on the eyes!
I learned a while back that you have to make time for the fun things or you will never do them. There is always another job! Took me awhile to figure that one out and still slip once in a while but I really try not to do weekends or nights if possible. Life's too short not to have some fun on a regular basis.
scotty B
06-30-2002, 02:03 PM
I hear ya Scott I refuse to work weekends anymore. I will work late to get the job done but the weekends are mine and my families. My son and I ride 4 wheelers so we go camping alot and just hang out, he is only 5. Plus he has baseball games and stuff, so I dont miss any of them..
tileguytodd
06-30-2002, 02:18 PM
Balance grasshopper!!! Ive been preachin that theory for years.Now if i could just learn to apply it to myself!! :D
Bud Cline
06-30-2002, 10:13 PM
I don't know how you guys can afford to take so much time off work.
Hell, John Bridge and I both work a rigid 9am to 2pm schedule five days a week. Week after steenking week and you don't hear us braggin' about takin' time off.
Boy that reminds me, I've only got three days to work this week and get five days worth of stuff done to stay on schedule. I may just have to stay until 3 o'clock one day just to make up for lost time.
4th of July comin' up ya know.
tileguytodd
07-01-2002, 06:48 AM
OK OK I took yesterday off!! And dont let you catch me doing it again :D
Sonnie Layne
07-01-2002, 08:19 AM
Damned, you get 14 MPG???? YOu must have one of those new fangled get abouts!
tileguytodd
07-01-2002, 04:44 PM
Kinda Newfangled,Its a 1991 Chev2500with 180,000 miles on it,but it doesnt burn oil between changes,everything still works,its only been hit by the forklift once and its the best riding 3/4 tonHD ive ever been in.
The newfangled part is the new 3 door topper i put on last year.Color coded and lettered.(almost made the truck look new:D
tileguytodd
07-01-2002, 04:45 PM
Oh and you can see the lettering i put on it at http://www.warba.com :)
tileguytodd
07-01-2002, 04:47 PM
Excuse me http://www.warba.net geez i cant find my own homepage DOH!!!!! :D
[Edited by flatfloor on 07-01-2002 at 08:31 PM]
flatfloor
07-01-2002, 06:35 PM
You have an extra space or something in there too. I tried to fix it but thought better of fooling with your post. ;)
87 in good ol downtown Warba right now according to the Warba Warbler. :)
[Edited by flatfloor on 07-01-2002 at 08:41 PM]
Sonnie Layne
07-01-2002, 06:55 PM
he didn't include the .net in the url.
warbling on along... ;)
tileguytodd
07-06-2002, 01:31 PM
call it typing fatigue :D
kdzgon
07-11-2002, 02:18 AM
Scotty, at the risk of being a naysayer, I think you need to think twice before you open up a retail store just yet. I STRONGLY recommend you go out and get the book "The E-Myth" and read it before you take another step. I guarantee you will not be sorry you read it.
You say you are working on your business plan, yet it seems you have not adequately identified your potential market (demand as well as competition) or defined your goals. Only then can you decide if your plan of action is compatible with those goals. You say it's your priority to spend lots of time (incl. all weekend) with your family (understandable), yet I'm not sure you realize the time investment required to get the business off the ground. And if "[you] will not kiss arse just to get work", I'm not sure you should EVER get into retail!
BTW, I disagree in part with those that said "just do it better than the others...". If you do not market yourself, you could be the best in the world, but yet still go broke. Word-of-mouth is marketing but it takes time to develop, so you need to find alternatives in the meanwhile.
I repeat: Get get the book ... you will not be sorry!
Laurie
tileguytodd
07-12-2002, 06:56 AM
Laurie, You forgot the 2 most important considerations.#2Retail is alot of work .70-80 hour weeks for the first couple years etc etc.and the #1 reason not to go into retail--It sucks!!!!!!!!!!:D
Sonnie Layne
07-12-2002, 08:38 AM
Laurie,
Great advise, I'll get the book this weekend (as I lay around the pool with this beautiful mouthful of Cotes du Rhone I found on sale). John MAY have owned more businesses than I, but he's got 20 years or so on me! :) I'll enjoy some weekends off for now, but there's a transition coming along, I feel it in my bones.
Gosh, if my CPA could only talk to me in one day what you expressed in a few sentences I'd feel I was getting my money's worth. I take it you studied business as well as numbers and tax law. Thanks.
s
kdzgon
07-12-2002, 09:16 AM
Actually, no, Sonnie - never studied business. (Love tax law, though!) Raised 4 kids (lots of "OJT", learning to use common sense), and watched many businesses grow and/or fail...(incl many of my clients).
Add to that the seminar where I learned about that book (The E-Myth, revisited, by Michael Gerber)- the guy had garbage for a product, but boy, oh boy, could he sell! Relating that to what I have seen over the years just within my own practice, I realize that without goals (preferably written ones!), you cannot have sufficent focus. And without good marketing, you will most likely fail sooner or later.
This shyster ended the seminar by suggesting we read that book, and recommend it to our clients. I read the book, and immediately went out and bought a bunch of copies to give to my clients. Read Chapter 1 here: http://www.e-myth.com/learn/book_ch1_01.htm (Also check out the "Analyze Your Business' feature at the site here:
http://www.e-myth.com/learn/needsanalysis.htm )
While many of you here will glance at it and say "sure, but I'm a "little guy", I say give it a chance. I'm pretty sure you'll find something in there that is useful. And if you are just starting out, it is a great tool to help you identify IF you should be on your own, and then how to go about it.
Second best book: The Cashflow Quadrant™
by Robert T. Kiyosaki and Sharon L. Lechter C.P.A.
exerpt here: http://www.twbookmark.com/books/36/0446677477/chapter_excerpt10367.html
And for yourself and your kids (teenaged and up): Rich Dad, Poor Dad, also by Robert T. Kiyosaki
Laurie
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