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dmmoss
03-26-2005, 04:13 PM
Looking for advice on screwguns from those in the know. From your personal experiences which brand and model preforms the best. "Autofeeders" preferred not 1 flipping screw at a time. I like to get lots of work done and have been self feeding long enough. :) Thanks...

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MHI
03-26-2005, 04:19 PM
What are you using it for?

I use a roofing nailer for cbu's on floors, and a decking/drywall screwgun for walls. I don't think screws are nessesary for floors. For plywood subflooring, I use ringshank nails in a framing nailer. I know they hold good because when I have to pull one out, the head usually breaks off before the nail comes out.:)

dmmoss
03-26-2005, 04:24 PM
Mainley to screw down CBU. I like ring snank nails but the head size concerns me. thx..

MHI
03-26-2005, 04:38 PM
Dave,

I use roofing nails for the cbu, and the ring shank for subfloors (ply). A nice coil roofing gun makes short work of nailing down cbu's. Small floors I hammer them in instead of bringing the compressor. Still faster that screws. I wish Paslode would make a cordless roofer.

Ever tear up a floor that was thinseted and nailed? Not fun.

I use screws on the wall cbu only because it causes less damage to the other finished side. :)

dmmoss
03-26-2005, 04:44 PM
Not a roofing nail fan. Screws are it for us. Just my preference. I know roof nailers are FAST. I prefer non-rusting deck type screws, just looking to pick up the pace but still use them. thx... :)

dmmoss
03-26-2005, 04:45 PM
oh yeah tore up a boat load of them floors too... :)

MHI
03-26-2005, 04:49 PM
You might want to check out the price of the screws for the autofeeders.$$$$ :)

dmmoss
03-26-2005, 04:58 PM
I have. Deck screws are not cheap either but either is good work. thx. :)

michaelhazuka
03-26-2005, 05:24 PM
I use the Milwaukee stand up screw gun...have to look at the gun to find out the model, but I know it listed new for around $575.00. I rarely use the screw gun, but when I do I can usually fasten around 500 sq ft in an hour with it...

-Mike

Tool Guy - Kg
03-26-2005, 06:56 PM
I had that Milwaukee gun and it is hands down the most kick-arse gun out there for this use. But after a year of fighting HD trying to get fasteners I gave up. Home Repot took it back because they neither stock, nor could the screws I needed. I paid $400 when I bought it about 6 years ago.

I bought a cheaper gun to take its place. I think it's called the QuickDrive 2000. The mechanism is made by QuickDrive and the screwgun is a DeWALT. It's ok, and I can get fasteners for it any time I want. But I wouldn't get it again. The DeWALT spins at 4000 RPM. That's just too fast. The screw head doesn't have the opportunity to pull the cement board down into the mortar. It goes so fast, it just shoots into the board like a bullet. I tried to get the version that was supplied with a Porter Cable driver because it is only 2500 RPM. More torque and last longer.

If you can get that Milwaukee system and have access to the screws, I think that is the best set-up I've seen. She sits around collecting dust, till you need her and you are glad you have it.

BTM
03-26-2005, 07:07 PM
I too researched this topic and REALLY wanted the Milwaukee..........but

the price was not feasible at this time, so I purchased the Senco Duraspin for $100. There are cement board screws for it. 1000 in a bucket.
My biggest BEEF with this tool is the bits. I have gone through 5 of em for that bucket of screws. HD sells em at $10 a 2pack. :sick: That's about the cost of the screws. If I had my druthers, I wouldn't of bought it. Hopefully it will come in handy for sheetrock or somethin

Now, if somebody makes CARBIDE bits for it, then it could prove useful :idea:

Madison Mike
03-26-2005, 07:56 PM
I have a Quikkdrive 2000 and really liked it, but the screws are a little expensive. The only thing I don't like abolut it is that you have to get the screws at a lumber store, which means I have to get organized and plan my trip, which really doesn't happen as often as I'd like.
I've used a friend's Senco Duraspin. I spins slower than the Quikdrive, but it's still pretty useful. It's an inexpensive gun that works well. The downside is that the only screws I found for it (not that I looked all over) were coarse thread drywall screws.

Just a user's opinion

Mike
Madison, WI

RandyL
03-26-2005, 08:18 PM
I think that if you have to do any screwing or nailing, that your much better of with any quick feeding device. I'm sure that they are all good tools. Up here the milwakee will run me around $800 Canadian.....too much........ I'm headin' for the quickdrive at half tha price. They apperently have a new system that stops jamming and stuff. I've never owned....only used. They are 100% fully guaranteed which is a goood bonus. By the way when I say 100% .......I mean it...I have a friend that had a problem and t was taken care of right away.......no questions..............kinda like MOEN fuacets..........

Tool Guy - Kg
03-26-2005, 09:06 PM
Randy,
With the QuickDrive 2000, I have never had a jamb of any sort. QuickDrive has their stuff together. I would recommend the gun, I just don't like how the DeWALT driver spins at 4000 RPM. I'd buy this gun again if I could get it with the slower RPM Porter Cable as the driver.

I'd still perfer the Milwaukee.....oh yea......smooth machine. Well built.......but dangit, I can't get the screws easy enough. :bonk:

justin savage
03-27-2005, 06:40 AM
www.juldan.com has screws for the senco guns that are for cbu.we like the senco screw gun we have , not that expensive.justin savage :)

tileguytodd
03-27-2005, 06:52 AM
I see Senco just came out with a Cordless collated gun in 14.4V with reverse.
Might be handy for guys that like to screw CBU in tubs and showers.It would be pretty fast I Imagine.Would be handy for small entries and Bath floors also.

One of the shops around here started using staples on Plywood installs.
I asked about this and they said they tested it and it was harder to remove a sheet of Plywood stapled to OSB subfloor (using a 2-3 edge and 4-6 field pattern)than it was to remove a sheet that was screwed (3-4 edge and 8" field pattern)

Ive never done this or tested it but am curious if anyone else has done it.
Any thoughts??

BTM
03-27-2005, 07:44 AM
Todd

Having owned a staple gun for 20 yrs or so, I can say that yes, it will be damn tough to remove a sheet of ply. Espescially if it is hit every 4" as you say. I think the 'nail in the coffin' would be to drive em in at an angle & change directions a few times per sheet. I use it a lot for putting up lath for phony stone or muddin a shower. Ya don't want to make a mistake & have to tear it off, cause it's a PITA.

As far as that Senco, I am beginning to think that the slower spinning model may not CHEW up the phillips bits quite so fast. And, I think they have an 18v model also....more power, but it spins faster. Anyone know if there is a source to buy the drive bits in bulk? $5 a pop is going to kill that gun. Oh, it still puts in the screws, but it gets expensive........BOB

tilemanct
03-27-2005, 07:56 AM
I have two Quickdrive Guns. One was a loner while my other was being fixed. I would not recomend the Quickdrive at all. The strips are too short for production work and the cement board screws and tip just dont work well at all. You have to manually pull the strip through the gun. I can screw by hand faster. The cost of screws are expensive. For CBUs go with a roofing nailer with the ring shank roofing nails. You will have a much flatter floor. I have used the Senco unit and it was much better than my Quick Drive could ever be.

cx
03-27-2005, 07:59 AM
It's my experience that you never, ever remove plywood or OSB intact that has been installed with half-inch crown staples. You'll get a few of the staples to come out with the board, but the majority are gonna remain in the framing along with a bit of the sheeting, which makes it difficult even to just drive them flush. I'd much prefer to remove sheathing that has been installed with round-head, smooth shank, coated coil nails, or even ring-shanks, although that ain't no picnic, neither. I'd done all my roof decking and wall sheathing with the stapler for years. I do a lot of it with a coil gun now, too, but frequently still staple.

But when it comes to subflooring, I still want those screws. I generally use the coil nailer some to get the panels down on the glue right quick and keep it in place, then screw the rest of the schedule.

tilerite
03-27-2005, 12:48 PM
Very informative thread, guys. I mostly use 1/4 inch hardi on floors and prefer to screw it down with with my cordless drill using sheetrock screws. I can move pretty quickly, but bending over is a bit hard on the back. I almost bought a quickdrive (DeWalt model) from a local pawn shop. I could have had it for $ 150.00, but I'm still not totally sure which direction I want to go with this. The roofing gun also sounds like a viable option. Keep on discussing, and I'll keep on reading, and hopfully I'll make up my mind before my next large cbu install. Happy Easter.
-Rick

Bill Vincent
03-27-2005, 06:45 PM
I've been using the Senco "pogo stick" (their corded gun with the extension) for a couple of years now, and I'll swear by it. I just sold one of my guns to a GC last thursday, and I've got an 18 volt on order to pick up this friday. Thanks, though, to Justin for that online source for screws, though. While I can get them thru my local Dal warehouse, it's about an hour's drive away, and can get pretty inconvenient. I've gotten to the point where I'm buying screws 12,000 at a time!! Atleast now, I don't have to travel for them. Thanks again! :)

rob 223
03-27-2005, 07:05 PM
I use the quick drive with sheetrock screws, it works great for me. I know some say it a no no to use drywall screws on cb but Ive had to pull some out before(not due to failure) and it was no easy task and felt confident with the screws for cb on floor installation.

michaelhazuka
03-27-2005, 08:19 PM
Thanks, though, to Justin for that online source for screws, though. While I can get them thru my local Dal warehouse, it's about an hour's drive away, and can get pretty inconvenient. I've gotten to the point where I'm buying screws 12,000 at a time!!

I usually buy the buckets of screws at the Home Despot....I hate to step foot in the store, but somethings I really can't avoid. I purchase the square tip collated type that come in a bucket of 1000 screws. I believe I average about 120 sq ft per bucket, but I typically will screw my sheets more than what I need to. Seems to be the most efficient route I use, but then again the majority of my installations are over SLC with in-floor heat.

Speaking of SLC, in Green Bay we have a store specializing in the installation of SLC(not gypcrete). They are marketing to new construction, and are installing SLC for a small fraction more than CBU installation. Smooth installation, flat as glass, and one solid performing subfloor system. If there are any enterprising individuals out there that are looking to expand their business, I would seriously consider this as a viable business expansion option. The builders love it, the homeowners love it(I love it)...a WIN-WIN situation for all, and their overhead isn't too significant with the exception of the initial cost of the pumping equipment.

At this moment there is NO COMPETITION for them, and they are pushing the gypcrete installers out of the residential sector in my area(where they belong...can't STAND GYPCRETE!!! :bang: ). The SLC guys are easily installing 2-3 homes PER DAY and each home is AVERAGING 750-900 s.f. of SLC. Do the math...it would be a great investment if your region doesn't already have an installation team such as this. I am up north, so slab installation isn't too common...99.99% of the homes have basements.


-Mike

michaelhazuka
03-27-2005, 08:32 PM
And I've also noticed a predictable increase in the amount of radiant heat installations as the cost of boilers, tubing, etc., have decreased. For my contractors, I would make a safe assumption that 75% of the new homes being built have radiant heating systems installed at the new construction stage. Not only below grade for the basement, but most have a significant amount on the first floor too.

The last Showcase home I finished had all three floors installed with radiant heat tubing, and also the garage and driveway(didn't want to shovel :crazy: ). It was over 7000 s.f. in the home alone, but the concrete contractor did the basement and driveway areas..that was 2 days of pouring on one job for the SLC guys and they really didn't work too hard.

Think about that the next time you're humping tile upstairs to a second story master suite. It kind of made my wonder why I spent 3 weeks completing the tile when the SLC crew spent two days and made a KILLING!

-Mike