HOW ABOUT MEDIUM BED MORTARS?

[chip]

I believe that the majority of manufacturers offer a product that falls into this category.

Most people aren't aware of them and or don't understand the benefits.

How about you?

Thin sets, thin bed. Thin sets aren't designed to be used with a large (1/2 x 1/2) notched trowel, or larger.

The aggregate (sand) is larger in the medium bed products to give you greater stregnth. They also reduce the need for back buttering due to the fact that you are using a large notched trowel.

These products are normally available in both grey and white.

Anyone with hands on? Anyone don't believe? Anyone want to talk about anything? HELLO.

[Sponsored Links]

[kalford]

WHAT ABOUT GLUEING THEM DOWN?????lol

Keith Alford
"There's one in every crowd"

[chip]

NEVER.

WHAT IS LOL? LACK OF ?

THERE IS MORE THAN 1.

[Bud Cline]

You know Keith, your laughing but that ain't so damned funny maybe.

I was called one time to see if I could figure out what went wrong with a DIY kitchen. I arrived to find 8 X 8 octagons with dots on plywood, about 250 square feet. Most of the octagons were cracked in all kinds of directions and the floor rattled when you walked on it. It was like walking on razor blades.

This ole boy and his wife installed this tile with Liquid Nails, one 11 ounce tube at a time, just dabs and snakes here and there. I guess it was ok for a long time until the adhesive began to get really hard like that stuff does.

Have you ever tried to remove that much Liquid Nails from plywood? Don't!

They said the guy at the store tried to tell them what to use but it was much to complicated and the tile boxes were heavy enough they didn't want to carry those bags too.

What 4 bags??


And yes I was LOL, in fact, I was LMAO all the way home.

[Sonnie Layne]

I can relate, Bud.
I dont' have the answer, but I've no doubt there will come along an adhesive that will be akin to mastic, but available in a tube that will outdate our current practices. Don't get me wrong, current practices are much more body friendly than previous and they've been proven to work for thousands of years (when exactly did the Romans quit speaking Latin and start speaking Italianese?), but the wonder of the human imagination leaves all avenues open. I've seen it in the painting world, no doubt it's coming your way (tile setting)as well.

Truly

[Bud Cline]

Pre-mixed thinset is here but pricy as hell.

I've also seen pre-mixed thinset in tubes (somewhere) of a sufficient quantity to tile approximately 12 square feet, the size of the average shower base. I don't know what their thinking is for the partial wall that would most-times also be a part of the floor thing in a repair.

[Rob Z]

Not only do I know what medium bed setting material is, I have even used it on actual jobs!

Discuss away...

Rob

[chip]

I knew I could find a sucker.

No actually, the industry believes there is a great need for this type of product. But I'm finding very little recognition of the product and don't sell alot.

So you are the guy I was fishing for, what do you think of this type of product? Do you believe that the larger agg. is a benefit? Is it important to have good coverage on the edges and corners of say a 16 x 16 tile?

Artsy

[John Bridge]

Hey Artsy,

If you'll tell me what the stuff is supposed to do, I might have something to say. And here we go with the "industry" again. Dave? Are you lurking?

[chip]

thin sets are designed to be just that, thin.

1/2 x and larger trowels are used all the time with thin set and the sand isn't large enough to give you the strength you need to stand up.

When they pour roads they use larger agg. than they do on side walks, for greater strength.

When using a large notched trowel, you reduce the coverage of the bag of thin set due the size of the notches, the same will accure with medium bed.

when your ridges can stand up uniformily and give the support to the tile that is required you can be assured of a sucsessfull installation.

These products are designed for large body tile, 13x13 & up, & marble due to the veigning which makes it so fragile.

Hey, we are all the industry.

Art

[Rob Z]

Art

Don't confuse a large tile that is relatively flat on the underside going over a flat substrate with a relatively un-flat/cupped tile with large voids on the underside going over a substrate that is either flat or not.

For a large tile that is smooth on the back going over a flat substrate, the use of a 1/4 x 1/2 U notch will likely yield good coverage and, when examined from the side, show the targeted 3/32 to 1/8 bed of material.

You're right about the need for use of medium beds when the substrate and/or tile call for it. Thinset is not designed to correct irregularities in the substrate.

Unfortunately, when I need a medium bed mortar I have to beg and plead to get someone to bring it in for me.

Why can't my good friends at Bonsal send me some samples? All my college friends that are in big shot corporate jobs get free trips and rounds of golf. I just want some setting materials!

No dice on Bonsal getting me a PROPAN fact sheet.

Rob

[chip]

You are right about the flat tile, flat substrate scenario.

What I'm finding is they are few and far between. If you have the top of a stone protruding from your substrate, your tile will rock. With a medium bed mortar and large trowel the material left under your edges and corners is taller and when cured will have the strenght to protect the install.

Free goods, you have already used medium bed mortar and understand the principles.
Did you ever email David?
I had conversation with him just this evening via email and asked him if he had gotten with you and he said he would this week end, he's out of town, I think he's golfing with one of your college buddies. Just a joke.

Get with the guys at Conestoga and set up a 4 some, David is a great golfer and he has been known to pick up a check or 2 in his day.

Sorry about the delay, Hey, I just got the new Pro-form Brochure today, email me your address and I'll put one in the mail to you.

Take good care,

Art

[Rob Z]

Art

A fishing or hunting trip will go over better with me and the guys at Conestoga. Golf is okay, but I shoot a gun a lot better than putt.

I'll email you my address for the new brochure. (It DOES have the Propan in it, doesn't it??)

I don't contend with those wacky substrates that often because I have attempted to be a mud man like JB. I mud most floors. We floated some today, as a matter of fact. I haven't quite perfected John's ability to "stand around" yet, though.

I'm working on it.

Let me try that medium bed. I'll use the heck out of it.

How thin can it be applied? Most state how thick they can be used (typically up to 3/4 inch).

Rob

[chip]

Hey, David is a hunter too.

How thin? I've never been asked that before.

I'd say due to economics, it does cost a little more, 3/8 x 3/8 would be as thin as you would want.

Also a great product for exterior installations over rough or pitted concrete.

Tell Conestoga and David that you want it, I'm sure they will stock it for you.

take care,

Art